Marciano – What means more the 49 or the 0?
January 14th, 2010
By Dennis Broadhurst: Rocky Marciano, a boxer that everyone has heard of, the only undefeated heavyweight champion of all time (49-0 with 43ko’s). Rocky was a great fighter, what he lacked in skill, size and speed he made up for in heart, chin, stamina and power! Rocky was a stalker with great power in both hands, most notable his “Suzie-Q”, he would never stop coming forward and his fantastic stamina allowed him to do that for as long as the fight took.
Now Rocky had 49 fights in which he won them all but his most notable opponents were Ezzard Charles, Joe Louis, Jersey Joe Walcott and Archie Moore. Ezzard Charles was perhaps the greatest light-heavy of them all and moved up to heavyweight giving Rocky two of his hardest fights but falling short like all others. Joe Louis was past it when Rocky fought him and was knocked out of the ring.
Walcott was 38 when Marciano fought him but was still a great fighter who floored Rocky in the first and outboxed him for thirteen rounds before Rocky ended things with one punch. Rocky’s final battle against Archie Moore who was in his early forties, Rocky was down in the first but recovered and stopped Archie like 43 other unfortunate opponents.
Seeing that Marciano had some good wins against good fighters, I still ask myself the question “What was more important, the 49 or the 0?” In Marcaino’s 49 he defended his title just six times before retiring and only really fought four great fighters, three of which who were 37 years or over. Now I think that Marciano’s 49 does not mean much at all when people rate him and that it is only his 0 that keeps him up there with the greats, there is no denying that Rocky was a great fighter but had he not got the 0 on his record then where would YOU rank him?
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I have read all of the above responses, and I’d like to add a few things. To the individuals who say Marciano fought “smaller” fighters….are you actually serious? For one thing, Marciano was not far out of “light heavyweight range” himself. In fact, if he lost about 8-10 pounds, he could have fought as a light heavy. Ezzard Charles and Archie Moore for example were basically the same size as Marciano. As far as age is concerned, maybe Marciano was younger then some of his opponents, but then again….Rocky wasn’t exactly a teenager either when he won the title, he was pushing 30 years old himself. Him and Charles were really only about 2-3 years apart. I believe Charles was 34 and Marciano was 31. In boxing….either age is considered getting “old” lets be real. Marciano also lacked experience as compared to the majority of his opponents. he lacked size, reach, and what many also don’t know about Rocky Marciano is….he suffered from back complications, especially during his title reign. So, what others may have had against them with “age” Marciano also had disadvantages himself. Yet, He won, and majority by KO. What if Rocky had boxed longer, thus, had gathered more skills then he did? Frankly, I think he would have KO’d some of his opponents even quicker then he did. Ok, granted, Louis was 10 years older, but then again, he was a fighter, former champion, and a legend, going against a smaller man with no where near the experience of himself. What Louis lacked in age, he could have also made up for with ring experience, something he had all over Rocky hands down. Yet, on brute strength and heart, Rocky beat him. I do believe a younger Louis would have lasted much longer, definitely. Rather then an 8th round KO, Rocky may have caught him more in the 13th or the 14th, but I do believe Marciano would have still beaten a prime Louis. Also, since people want to beat up on Marciano for who he fought….who did Louis ever truly fight that was great? A fat, out of shape nobody like Tony Galento dropped Louis, Max Schmeling knocked him out (in his prime), Tommy Farr many believe was robbed, and Billy Conn (a light heavyweight who was not nearly as strong as Marciano) nearly beat him. he only lost because he made the fool mistake of trading with Louis in the late rounds. If he kept boxing and stayed away, he may have very well beaten Louis. Jersey Joe Walcott also dropped Louis several times in their fight. What if that had been Rocky Marciano who dropped him? Frankly, I don’t think Louis would have gotten back up each time as he did against Walcott. I agree, Louis was a great boxer, but the fact is, he too fought his share of “nobodies” just as many other Champions did. The fact is….we will never know unless you put all of these guys into the ring when they were all in their primes. Not out of partiality or anything like that, I still believe Marciano would have defeated the same men he had beaten, if younger. Perhaps longer and tougher fights, but he would have still won.
However, even though I am a huge Marciano fan, I am also a realist. Would Marciano had beaten the likes of Ali in his prime? Yes and no. Marciano’s weakness was that he cut easy. I don’t believe Ali would knock Marciano out, but a win by decision or by TKO (stoppage due to cuts) yes. Ali could cut you worst then Ezzard Charles did, but Ali was bigger and much faster then Charles was. However, Marciano was much like a Joe Frazier, and if he got close or cornered Ali, he could have KO’d him. I also believe Marciano could get through Ali’s “rope a dope” and it would not have beaten Marciano as it did Foreman. I believe Foreman was bigger and stronger, but, he tired quicker then Rocky did, Marciano’s stamina would not quit. Rope a dope against Marciano is a mistake, Ali would definitely have to keep moving and box him with the legs and the speed. I believe that “pound for pound” Rocky was as strong or even stronger then most of the heavyweights today (pound for pound). But, a good big man will usually beat a good little man. Marciano would not be undefeated in the Heavyweight class today, the boxers are just to big and strong. But, I do believe he would still have been great today as a light heavyweight. His opponents would be the likes of a Roy Jones Jr, Bernard Hopkins, etc. How do you feel Marciano would do against a Roy Jones? Lets discuss that scenario.
Marciano’s record speaks for itself, some of these heavyweights now days were not even borne. Marciano worked hard, in the 15th round he looked the same as the first round. As for him fighting archie moore, or ezard charles, lewis,these men were pretty even on the scale. as for now the heavys are 245lbs and 6’7″ different class, and time. in the future the heavis might be say 300lbs and 7′ 2″ this chainges all the time. example the hight in basketball was 6’1″ now it is over 7’2″average.
There was a gentleman, who stated, that Marciano would have a chance against either of the Klitschko’s..
C’mon fellas, give me a break!
Marciano had a life-and-dead battle against 34-year old lightheavy Charles, and then to imagine Marciano against a 250 pound Klitschko????
At least the rock has fought 4 good boxers. Far more better than Kenducky Fraud Checkin (KFC)
Marciano was fhe only heavyweight to retire undefeated, becouse, he did not wait till he got to old, out of shape. He ment business when he got in the ring, he would bang on you, till you could not hold your arms up anymore, then what. He had lightening punches. No complaints from the peolple he beat up.
Rocky Marciano is in my opinion a top 3 heavyweight of all time. It annoys me when people speak of the age of his oponents in his prime ie louis , walcott , charles. These men were not ancient and if u seriously compare other fighters at their peaks they fought older men too. A lot of tysons peak opponents were older for starters as were alis and larry holmes and even joe louis. Marciano beat every man ever put in front of him and knocked most of them out , he had the grit of a champion and absolutely devastating power. I even strongly believe he would cause the big eastern european fighters of today a lot of problems, vitali and wlad would succumb to one of his big shots at some time in the fight simply because of the pace he would have set, they are both blowing like old men after a few rounds when put on the back foot and wlads chin is way too suspect . Quite simply they would avoid a man like him at all costs because hed hit them back. Appreciate and respect marciano and think on that maybe a lot of those men he destroyed would have been in the top 3 in the world in the present heavyweight division
Who did Marciano beat? He was overrated just like most Itallian fighter in that era. He fought older, smaller men. Even an old Archie Moore knock him down. ..old Louis…old Ezzard Charles…He retired not to fight maybe a Floyd Patterson or a Sony Liston.
In Vegas there was an old guy, Ben Skelton (RIP) a real old time boxing character. In his later years he managed a car wash near my home but he spent a good part of his young life as a professional sparring partner.
Ben worked with every champion from Joe Louis to Sonny Liston. I used to talk boxing with him all the time. Once I asked him who was the hardest puncher he ever sparred with. He answered hands down; Marciano.
Old Ben was a big guy, even slightly hunched over with age he was well over 6 feet & hand giant hands. He said if Rocky couldn’t reach you he would land hooks on your arms & shoulders and after two minutes you were basically a heavy bag with feet, you could hardly throw a punch, it was truly painful.
There was nothing sexy going on, Rocky threw every punch with the intention of damaging something, anything, anybody. Ben said people HATED sparring with the little guy (His words) He just beat them so hard & never got tired.
Would Rocky have an ’0′ on his record if he fought in the Heavyweight Golden Era of the 70′s? No way.
Would Rocky be too small for a modern heavy like one of the K-Bros? Definitly.
But for sure most of the lard asses waddling around the ring these days calling themselves heavyweights would have been terrorized by that little man.
I think the fact that Marciano had a high KO% and he retired with the belt. That kind of ranks him pretty high aswell. If Ali would’ve lost all his toughest fights do you think we would really rate him as high.
……top 5 (heavyweights)
Broadhurst-you questioned his 49-0 record, skills, speed, and size. You also said “he always found a way” Its all about winning, picking yourself up when your down, and having a heart. Yeah its no secret that he wasnt the best skilled fighter, but he never gave up. He didnt win 49 fights on accident, he still had step in the ring and fight the guy arcoss from him. He’s an all time great.
you do not pick the era you fight in. Rocky had a late start due to his military service. Johanson was king in 1959.
Look, I truly apologize if I offended your wiew of your legend, and I know that you may feel that it is like spitting on the flag. That said, lets be realistic! Marchiano was knoked down by light heavyweights, and didnt face the top contenders of the day. Hes opponents were hand-picked and old. Yes, he had heart, yes he could punch, but to call him an all-time great is an insult to men like Liston, Ali, Foreman and Holmes. If Marchiano had faced Liston, picture Marchiano getting beat much in the same manner as Patterson. Maybe he would have lasted 20 seconds longer than Patterson, who knows..
What you gotta understand is that fighters those days went 15 rounds what great stamina they had needless to say they also wore 8oz gloves which is hardly nothing..our fighters today are huffing and puffing by the 11th round..you gotta give those guys props…but anyway the rock was a great fighter in his days if he would of started fighting in the Joe Lewis prime that would be a fight to watch..
top 5 heavyweight of all time
ATG fought the best of his day. Always in shape. Short career (8 years) though.
The fact that Charles, Moore, louis and the others you mentioned are over 30 is complete rubbish. If u look at a lot of the champions in those days they fought well into their 30s and maybe even more. Archie Moore, a better light heavy then ezzard Charles fought muhammad Ali when he was 47. They were harder men in those days he fought for pride no matter their age.
Gio,it you’ve got him ranked 50th then i love to see the 49 in in front of him!! right up to your all time number one heavyweight, please indulge us all.
The 49 and the 0 are meaningless without the other. They must be taken together.
Marciano was the best of his time: an era of smallish heavyweights with excellent boxing skills. Louis was past his best, but still had power and technique, if not reflexes anymore. Walcott seemed to NEVER get old and in fact was better in his 30′s than in is 20′s. Charles was an excellent smaller champion, and still near his prime. Moore is considered by many the greatest light heavyweight ever, and was very near the same size as Marciano. All of these challengers were KO’d by Rocky(Walcott twice).
Against all time great competition, I believe that the big hitters(Liston, Foreman) would have a better chance against Rocky than the lighter hitting boxers(Holmes, Ali). Because of his almost unhuman stamina, Rocky often roared back later in fights after losing the early rounds. This pattern seemed to happen over and over. If you did not have the punch to get rid of him early, then your chances reduced dramatically as the fight progressed.
Nice article this one…
I think the ’0′ is important as you pointed out…
Would Marciano have been as sucessful and kept his ’0′ if he fought more good fighters at a reasonable age rather than declining greats as you said?
Having not been alive then, it’s hard to give a definitive answer… but the highlights i’ve seen he looks as powerful and iron as most ‘great’ heavyweights!
shakeeb NawaZ > There is a big difference between fighting to win and not to lose. Take Tommy Morrison for instance, against almost any opponent he came foreward to knock their heads of with one of his devestating left hooks… ea fighting to win. Against George Foreman however he was on the backfoot, running, jabbing, avoiding, grabbing… Ali style Rope a dope.
He knew he’d problably won the fight if he used his normal coming forward hooking left, right, uppercut style but he wouldn’t take the risk to get caught by a Foreman KO punch. ea Boxing not to lose!
I dont agree with the article’s conclusion. It’s not about choosing between 49 or 0. It’s the whole 49-0 with 43 kos. This means everytime Rocky went inside the ring, he bravely tried to win every fight by knocking out the opponent and not be scared to being knocked out himself. This is what the fans are expecting from them, FIGHT TO WIN RATHER THAN FIGHT NOT TO LOOSE.
Niels Probst you are talking utter trash. I hate people who really know anything about boxing. Please leave this site to real boxing fans. And maybe read up on 50′s boxing!!
GIO- No hes not the worst fighter in history. Some one with a record of 49-0 is nothing short of a superb fighter. As you stated about him being a terrible fighter you fail to look at the styled achievments he made at gaited. To rank him 50 is nothing short of jelousey on your parked entrance. He allways fought the best and your fail to see that, unless you trained his opponants then how would you know if the were 2nd tier? Never judgea book and all that. Clearly passes you by though mate.
marciano was a good fighter no a great fighter. His greatest victories were over fighters that were way past their primes, but whatever he beat them.
I will always remember him as a good fighter but nothing more….is he one of the all time greats of heavyweights?..maybe number fifty and that is cutting him some slack. I dont think he ever faught prime opposition and if he did he faught 2nd tier fighters. A great guy and I have a lot of respect for him but dont let his record decieve you.
Matt devine. Your getting on my nerves son. Why is it rubbish. Dont you understand that the sports evolved? Just like humans. When were babies we talk rubbish, in your case you still do, with garden outlets by the way.
he would have been a cruiserweight today so stop all the rubbish talk.
mannys no rock , how did he get into a blogg about rocky marciano , jesus some fans carry on , next minute they’ll be saying hes the second bloke ever to walk on water.
To be true, Marchiano is the most overrated boxer that ever existed. Sorry if I hurt someones feelings. He would fall short against every decent former heavy champ, Witherspoon, Frazier, Foreman.. I also thin that men like Ron Lyle, Shavers and Chuvalo would have knocked him out with relative ease. If you hav a life and dead battle with a whashed up former light heavy champ you are just not even closed to be considered in the top ten of former champs.
And, really, that all there is to it. Sorry Marchiano supportes
For jujuhound;
http://boxrec.com/list_bouts.php?human_id=9032&cat=boxer
I agree with the article, the man was an incredible tough HW (actually nowadays he’s a cruiser) and a true champ. Only he himself knew he was fortunate to be a post Louis era fighter.
He defeated a Louis that had to come back from retirement with tears in his eyes, because he knew he was beating up a man that deserved more than this and he would be beaten up himself by a prime Louis.
But it doesn’t mean he wasn’t good, or his record is a Floyd… there was just nobody who could beat him in his era. You can rate him like a 50′s Mike Tyson, there just wheren’t any good contenders so he could beat up the faded former generation.
So he’s just hard to rate… noone knows how he had done in the previous generation, he problably wouldn’t have had a ‘Zero Loss’ record but I think he could take some Hall of Famers out or at least give them a handfull.
Regardless, 43 KO’s out of 49 Wins is pretty damn impressive. And after a quick wikipedia lookup… it seems that he’s the type of boxer who’ll go all out in each and every fight. You can knock him down, but he won’t stay down.
The boxing world needs more of his kind.
How was the playing field back then? Did he fight quality boxers before Archie Moore?
Pacquio is the next Marciano. He has a lot of heart in him. Pacquio’s stamina is unbelievable. Regardless what fraud Mayweather’s acussations, majority believes Floyd is a fraud and a coward. He only fights opponents which he thinks he has an edge. Go Pacquio Go!! A great fighter like Pacquio comes once in a lifetime!!