New Twist to Mayweather vs. Pacquiao!
July 19th, 2010
by Christian Ramos: It appears that there’s a new, maybe not so surprising twist to the Mayweather – Pacquiao saga. Leonard Ellerbe, Advisor and deeply close friend to arguably the P4P King Pretty Boy Floyd Mayweather Jr. broke his silence, revealing interesting details regarding the failed negotiations for the potential mega-fight between “Money” Mayweather and PacMan.
This is certainly a very interested chapter to the best-selling novel that is Mayweather-Pacquiao. At 3 a.m. Eastern Time (midnight pacific), Bob Arum stated he would move on to negotiations with Margarito and Cotto being that Floyd never responded to the July 16 deadline. He has also confirmed that the Mayweather fight is still his main interest, and the offer is still available as long as Manny is not under contract against any other fighter. The July 16 deadline was indeed just the expiration on the exclusivity period.
On Sunday, July 18, self-proclaimed “Cash Cow” of the sport broke his silence and spoke the Associated Press. “I’m not interested in rushing to do anything. I’m not really thinking about boxing right now. I’m must relaxing. I fought about 60 days ago, so I’m just enjoying myself, enjoying life, enjoying my family and enjoying my vacation. Like I said, I’m just supporting my family and relaxing. That’s what I’m doing right now.”
What’s even more interesting about this situation is that for weeks Bob Arum has been claiming that everything was ok and both sides agreed to the terms on the contract, but Arum stated that he has only spoken to Ross Greenburg who has served as a mediator with both sides. There obviously seems to be a problem somewhere between the terms Manny’s agreed to and the ones Team Mayweather has seen. No one outside of Top Rank has ever seen the contract. It did seem pretty suspicious for Mayweather to be fine with a 50-50 deal or even for Pacquiao to accept random drug testing up until the fight.
If the case is that Ross Greenburg has indeed been convinced by the terms, there’s also a big problem with that. Ross Greenburg is not Team Mayweather. Was Arum pulling a publicity stunt? Should have Bob Arum been more direct in contacting Team Mayweather before accepting a yes or no from someone outside of the team? Should have Team Mayweather been more involved with the negotiation attempt or at least responding the public statements from Top Rank? Who knows? Looking at the bright side of things, at least we’re finally hearing from some important figures, the people that have to agree.
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reading on some comments from duckweather apologist. it’s arum fault blah.. blah.. look arum and pacman try to make the fight but fraud shows his true color, black on the outside and yellow on the inside.. why not just make it winner take all!! this fraud is stinking out the sports!!! just send this fraud to prison with his uncle!!
@An Honest Pacman Fan – We can certainly agree to disagree. And to answer your question.
Back in May, when Arum said the two camps were scheduled to start talks, what did Ellerbe say? He said that was FALSE.
Now, two months later, his story has, basically, not changed. How many times does he need to say that?
Maybe Ellerbe is lying, this time. Maybe not. The simple fact is…WHO CAN PROVE HE IS? If Arum is interested in doing so, he should be able to produce some evidence of someone’s, from the Mayweather sides, engagement with Ross Greenburg, at least. Maybe he will, in the coming weeks. I doubt it though.
@kray
We are going to go in circles now.. so let’s just stick to what believe and wait for more details ok…
@An Honest Pacman Fan – Same thing I told PeteDawg, I didn’t say that MEANT Arum was LYING (show me a quote, where I said that), it means that the only person he was in contact with, has refused to corroborate his story, for reasons of his own. It may not say Arum was lying, exactly. But, it certainly does not indicate he was telling the truth, now does it?
@kray
Let’s just stop this because you aleady made your mind up so that’s fine.
With the below statement:
“So, either they were respecting the ‘gag order’ or they simply were not involved in negotiations. ”
Well you tell me… after the number of weeks that Arum has made noise about what’s going on, why would they only make a comment now? mmmmm just don’t seem right…
@PeteDawg – I did not say that meant Arum was LYING. But, I certainly don’t buy his charade or GBP’s, for that matter. Team Mayweather, on the other hand, never made a peep, never leaked a comment…nothing. So, either they were respecting the ‘gag order’ or they simply were not involved in negotiations.
Which is it Pete?
Get off that ‘Pretty One’ sh\t, Pete. The simple fact is…NO ONE has corroborated the claims of either side. I am aware Greenburg has a vested interest in both fighters. So, he was far from a suitable ‘mediator’ for these so-called negotiations. Yet, that was Arum’s bright idea. FAIL…
@kray
as you said before believe what you believe…
But the question to you about Greenburg, is why didn’t he deny it neither?
So for you to imply that his noncomment is a sign Arum is lying but you tell me that I’m giving Floyd a double standard for not commenting?
You are the one that first applied that the noncomment was a proof of Arum lying..
For me, I never called Mayweather a coward… I do blame him for the fight not happening (at this point that is)
@An Honest Pacman Fan – OK man. So, when Floyd declines to comment, or gives a non-answer, he’s a COWARD. And, when Ross Greenburg declines to comment, he’s entitled to do so. Can we say…double-standard? Greenburg’s credibility is on the line too. Ellerbe said either Greenburg or Arum was lying. But, as you know, he alluded to Arum being the culprit. And now Greenburg, who’s, supposedly, been hustling to make this fight happen, has nothing to say? Hmmm…
Arum said he only talked to Ross Greenburg and ASSUMED his wishes were being shared with Team Mayweather. And he ASSUMED from what he heard, that ODLH said, was confirmation things were going well. Yet, OLDH and Richard Schaefer said he was misquoted, two days after he, allegedly, made that statement, on UNIVISION.
Maybe OLDH was honest, in, what were, reportedly, his initial comments on UNIVISION, and simply jumped the gun. Richard Schaefer even questioned him about those comments, saying…”I saw those quotes as well, and I had no idea what Oscar was talking about.” “And I called him up and asked him about them and he said that he was misquoted.”
If he did in fact make those statements, maybe ODLH just wanted to maintain optimism, even if he knew there either had been no talks, or they were not going as planned. But, if things were going as planned, why retract those statements later?
In any case, we simply DO NOT KNOW who’s lying and who is telling the truth, or whether there are elements of the truth buried in this somewhere, coming from both sides.
@ Big Lo
JMM does not belong in the the welters. The Marquez vs Mayweather was a side show to make a comparison between Floyd and Manny. Only blind melon believe that the man Floyd defeated was the same as the one Pacquaio defeated. It was a marketing scheme to salvage Mayweather place in the P4P ranking. Sympathizers are quick to note that the man Floyd made look ordinary was the same man that gave Pacquiao a run for his money. Floyd should have knocked him out if he wanted to make a point the way Pacquiao made Hatton his.
@Big Lo
No problem mate.. til the next time.. I’m sure this won’t be the last….
Thanks too…
@Honest,
Just to be clear, once again, I don’t say Mayweather wins easy. I said I fear that Pac is out of his league, but I also say that I’m concerned with Pac’s activity level. I certainly think this will be a tough fight for the 1st half, but after that I think the counters will start to take their toll and swell Pac up to the point that he doesn’t see punches coming (it also depends on the strategy that Roach has Pac employ – if Pac bumrushes, I see the fight one way, if Pac sets traps, I see the fight another way).
But, your point is WELL TAKEN, DLH got a split verdict based on his activity and aggession (after all, he only landed 10 punches per round), so Pac has just as good a chance at influencing the judges in the same way.
Anyway, my eyes need some rest, so I’m signing off for now, but thanks for another lively and meaningful debate.
@Big Lo
Yeah I remember what you are talking about.
See a lot of people would just set Pac aside and say he is a walk in the park for Mayweather, but by god…. there is so much that Pac can put on the table…
You already ofcourse expressed your views that Mayweather wins easy… but that’s your view…
For me Pac can win this with FEINTS and PRESSURE.
Because after all, the counter puncher relies on the ability to get the opportunity to counter..
and the FEINT can turn the counter puncher into the one being counter punched….
@Jesus,
Yes, the decisions are what they are and we have to respect them. But, when I said Pac failed, I was saying he failed to DOMINATE JMM in two fights. Yes, he won the 2nd (narrowly) and he drew in the 1st (due to the incorrect scoring), but I was responding to the post that Pac would destroy JMM in a 3rd match.
I don’t see that because he failed to DESTROY him in two previous attempts. That’s all. I’m not questioning the decisions (in fact, I have always said that since JMM went off his feet 4 times, nobody should complain that he didn’t win).
@ Big Lo
I don’t understand where Pacquaio failed in the Marquez fight. Sure it was a fight, a hard fight. A fight Pacquiao won twice. A fight that might have even defined how he looked at boxing in terms of training and getting better. In the eyes of his critics, he lost twice. It’s just like the Celtics fans claiming that Celtics really won that series and gave them a full page on a Boston Newspaper claiming them the true champions. Yes it was a close series but someone had to win in points and it came down to a few. Just like game winning shots, the losers always claims that they won that game if it wasn’t for the last shot.
Critics are critics. Why don’t you talk about Floyd’s true first lost but I’m not going there even if it’s obvious. That not how it went down. Floyd is undefeated period.
@Honest,
I’m glad you brought up the testing before Morales 1.
I didn’t learn about that interview until last summer. However, directly after the fight, when they interviewed Pac in the ring, his ONLY concern was the gloves that he wore (he was “duped” into Winning gloves instead of Reyes – remember that?).
My question has always been, why didn’t they mention the blood testing AT ALL in the ring (I don’t remember the interview word-for-word, but I remember thinking to myself – maybe the gloves would have made a difference because he really couldn’t hurt Morales).
Also, I’m not sure if Pac is on anything either (in fact, I never even considered it until last summer and then this whole thing got blown out of proportion).
@Big Lo
“The thing with Floyd’s shoulder roll is that fighters usually get frustrated and end up stop punching”
- I know Pac won’t stop punching… even being hit won’t stop him from punching… LOL!
“Let me ask you one final question. Do you think Pac can beat Floyd if he gets tested even a few days out?”
- First I don’t think he’s on anything
- second, how many days are we talking exactly? Because both of us recognize that when there is something weighing on a fighters mind then they should try and avoid being in that situation because it could cost them the fight
- third, I believe Pac’s weakness with the blood drawing because of that video of his interview after Morales1
- fourth, I believe either way, Pac has got a chance.. even if he doesn’t get tested I can’t say he wins.. nothing is definite and I also know Mayweather would be a big if not the biggest test
@Honest,
That is my BIGGEST concern if FLoyd and Pac fight. It’s Pac’s activity and Floyd’s lack of activity.
But, my feeling is that Floyd will be able to keep Pac on the outside most of the night, and when Pac tries to work his way in, Floyd ties him up (while eating a few angled shots here and there).
If this fight comes off, I don’t think it’s going to be as exciting as most. I think the jab is the key for Floyd, and he will shoulder roll which will make Pac come in close and bang away at Floyds arms and shoulders – but I’m not sure that’s going to be enough to steal the fight.
The thing with Floyd’s shoulder roll is that fighters usually get frustrated and end up stop punching becasue either they are just wasting energy or they are getting countered. This will be a big concern for Pac and Roach.
Let me ask you one final question. Do you think Pac can beat Floyd if he gets tested even a few days out?
@kray
They are not required to comment, if they wanted to deny it they could have right?
They don’t mediate now because the negotiation or mediation period is over…
They are not required to do anything…
“for the proper negotiation, arum should go straight to the mayweathers or the two camps meet in person to clear the air on wither to have the fight or not!!!!!” preleste
Nice STATEMENT… preleste, don’t necessarily agree with it, but it’s a statement. Soooo, why didn’t Mayweather who has a problem of diarrhea of the mouth didn’t make a DEFINITIVE statement saying there weren’t any negotiations going on on his BEHALF, just 48 hours ago? Why didn’t Team Mayweather do this immrediately after Arum proclaimed the deadline two weeks ago, in DEFINITVE TERMS just like what they stated yesterday?
Don’t worry I know it’s tough carrying your Idol’s water. But just imagine how big your arms are gonna get… LOL!!!
@Big Lo
First off let me start by saying that it wasn’t just the counter punching that allowed Marquez to hang with Pac:
- he is tough as nails (can take a punch).
- he comes and throws combinations, he didn’t just keep sliding and pot shot Pac. Everytime Pac came in, he will time Pac and throw his combos in there.
Now for me Pac is able to hang with Marquez not including his speed, able to take a punch, and whatever style he uses, there’s one intangible the he has that he always uses when stuck in a tough one.. and that is his heart, never say die…
Why I’m asking you this is that my opinion is that Mayweather can not win if he only potshots Pac. Remember when Mayweather fought Dela Hoya and he got a SPLIT decision?
Mayweathers shoulder roll is actually very good defense but against someone with Pac’s style he will lose on points because of inactivity. Pac will out work him in points if he only potshots. His best chance is actually to be in there and throw combinations but in saying that, we also know that this puts him in a situation where he could get ko’d..
Just my take anyway…
@Big Lo – Sure….at some point there could’ve been a back and forth. But, when?
We know Floyd said back in Feb, he wanted ODST for all his subsequent bouts. He also said a 50-50 split was not an option, next time around, if his numbers came out better. That was back in Feb. And we heard his drug testing stance repeated on May 1.
Now, the only people TALKING about drug testing or what the split would be, was Team Pac, when these so called negotiations began. We did not hear a word from Team Mayweather…no leaks…nada.
So, how do we know, Pac’s offer of a 14 day cutoff and rejection of 50-50 split, was in response to RECENT requests from the Mayweather camp? He could’ve very well have been issuing an INITIAL OFFER in response to things said prior to these so-called negotiations. One of the camps had to start these so-called negotiations off with some type of offer, right?
I’m not saying there was no attempt AT ALL by Arum. But, HIS, stated, preference was to do this through the network, as opposed to doing it with GBP and/or Team Mayweather. And the network does not seem interested in corroborating his story. Check Greenburg’s latest comments…”As always we have no comment.”
for the proper negotiation, arum should go straight to the mayweathers or the two camps meet in person to clear the air on wither to have the fight or not!!!!!
@Honest,
About your JMM question, I think it was because of the counterpunching, the distance, and the fact that JMM would fight with Pac in spots. JMM was moving to Pac’s right almost all fight long and he was able to neutralize his straight left (he also has a very solid right hand which is almost required against a southpaw).
Now, let me ask you, why do you think Pac was able to hang with JMM?
Insider, is there a problem with your thought process? It’s obvious that Ellerbe’s statement was FALSE. Their statement could have come out TWO weeks ago. Hell, it could have came out a month and SQUASHED this whole thing. The REASON they didn’t was because, there were negotiations going on AND if they would have come out EARLIER with this statement they could have killed the fight prematurely. Mayweather could have accepted the terms and agreed to the fight. As it was, Mayweather’s “CRACK” TEAM didn’t have a plan B. They thought Mayweather was going to sign off on the fight. Instead, the Pretty One came out and said that his mind isn’t on boxing. Now, in the dumbasses RUSH for DAMAGE CONTROL they’ve shot themselves in the foot, because they can’t refute anything that INSIDERS might say what was in the negotiations. ‘Cause according to them THERE WERE NO NEGOTIATIONS. hahaha… LOL!!! I really feel sorry for the Prett One’s fans. Now, there left to carry his water. LOL!!!
@Honest,
To be sure, I picked against Pac vs Morales, Marquez, and DLH. That’s it. Every other fight, I’ve picked Pac to win (primarily because of his speed).
I even picked him to beat Cotto, but I didn’t expect a stoppage or a one-sided beating.
Also, to your earlier post about Floyd treating his fans like a b1tch… First of all, I’ve made PLENTY of money off of Floyd (I’ve done well with Pac also, but I did lose big on the DLH fight). Secondly, Floyd isn’t my God. I like watching his brilliance in the ring (I’m not as concerned with what he, or any other boxer, does outside the ring), but he is not bigger than the sport (even if he thinks so). My life doesn’t begin OR end with Floyd. He just HELPS to maintain it.
I have a sneaky suspicion that the ones who complain about Floyd’s personality and his antics outside of the ring have a chip on their shoulders for one reason or another.
I don’t want to be one of them…
@Big Lo
Can I ask you what the biggest factor you think played on why Marquez hangs with Pac?
Do you think it’s plainly just because he counter punched the whole night? Is this what you think?
@Jesus,
You may be correct, JMM may not be in Pac’s league now. But, Pac has had TWO opportunities to prove that, and he failed both times (the fights were also 4 years apart). I’m not sure how many opportunities Pac needs to prove that he can dominate another fighter.
I am a big proponent of styles make fights, and I don’t believe for one minute that Pac dominates JMM (unless JMM fights with the wrong style – ala Morales 3 when he just tried to trade with Pac).
floyd the coward….floyed the coward….floyd the coward…floyd the coward…floyd the coward….floyd the cowad…floyd the COWARD!!!
With all you guys arguing this case Mayweather Pacman never came to any agreements there may of been negotiations but no agreements and no contract, Infact Mayweather wasnt even in the negotiations and didnt no nothing about Contracts or the headline Mayweather and Pacman come to an agreement because they didnt agree on anything verbally or officially, their for the contract wouldnt get signed if it ever existed
@Big Lo
I understand that it’s not easy for fighters to prepare… but Mayweather’s style isn’t even as full on as Pac and here you have a guy who still keeps on going.. considering his other responsibilities, he is still fighting.. add to that that he’s not going around rubbing into people’s face how good he is…
If Mayweather wants to be the greatest (which he thinks he is and rubs it to us fans all the time) the show it and don’t act like a diva…
You may think that Pac isn’t the cream of the crop but he sure as hell went beyond most of what you expected…
@Honest,
About divas in boxing, I don’t agree with diva treatment AT ALL. What you may not realize is that it take A LOT out of a fighter to go thru training camp and then to have a 12 round fight.
Honestly, the reason why prize fighters fight is because they can get paid. All serious fighters start out fighting VERY frequently (2-3 times per month). The primary reason is to make a living. Once you get to the DLH/ May/ Pac status, you can fight once per year and make a living. In fact, I’m willing to bet that most fighters would fight once per year if they could.
So, it’s a mistake to think that I support “diva” treatment. Again, I’m a Floyd fan, but I’m also a Berto fan, a Martinez fan, a Williams fan, a Marquez fan, a Dawson fan, a Ward fan, etc (I’m even an Emmanuel Augustus fan – and Humberto Soto).
To be completely honest, I’m not a Pac fan because I’ve been watching him since Ledwaba and I was NEVER impressed with him until late (really until Cotto). But, I am still not convinced that he’s the cream of the crop.
@ Big Lo
JMM is no where near the league Pacquaio is in now. It would be a slaughter. If Pacquaio is out of his league going after Floyd, I don’t mind. If theres ever a meaning for glory, the little man goes after it. I would be scared if a little guy trying to pick a fight with me. I would be in a world of a shell if this little guy beats me. Excuse me, I’m having Floyd’s thoughts run through my loud thinking.
@Jesus,
I agree. If Pac wants to retire, then so be it. He deserves to (although he’s still fairly young).
Also, I don’t want Manny to do anything. If he wants to fight Floyd, then Floyd has his demands. Since Floyd seems to me to be the one who is more “immature” in his demeanor, I would expect Manny to take the higher ground and give Floyd what he wants just to get the fight.
Now if Manny is seriously concerned about giving blood close to a fight, then I don’t expect him to give in to Floyd’s drug testing demand – and we won’t have a fight.
Also, to be perfectly clear (and I’ve said this many times also), I’m not really interested in seeing this fight because I fear that Manny is out of his league. I would MUCH rather see a rubber match between Manny and JMM (Manny has unfinished business there, as far as I’m concerned).
I also was hoping for a Manny-Valero fight.
@Big Lo
My bad, it was Jeff.. not sr.
And I also said on my previous post that Pac’s team does have contradictions too, so we agree on that one.
But see where I get annoyed is the fact that Mayweather puts it in front of all of us that he doesn’t care.
Mate, we want this fight, and as fans, I do believe we deserve this fight.
You won’t hold it against Mayweather that he won’t fight this year. Ok, fair enough…
Would you hold it against Pac if he retires after november?
See Pac has now a responsibility back in his country and getting this fight is now in a very high priority.. Missing out on the fight because of a diva doesn’t exactly sit well with me as a fan. I know it’s alright with you as you said, but that’s where you have swayed to become more of a Mayweather fan than a boxing fan.
It is so hard to get 2 of the best in the same generation and we would have been lucky (and hopefully we will) if the fight is made…
If it doesn’t, you know where my finger will be pointing at this point of the saga….
@Honest,
Don’t twist my words (and I certainly won’t hide from my words)!
Since Floyd has said he only fights once per year, if he doesn’t agree to a fight this year, then I’m not going to hold it against him. If he doesn’t agree to a fight next year, then I will hold it against him.
Also, if Floyd bows out of the Pac fight this year because he only fights once per year, but then turns around and fights a lesser fighter this year, then I will hold it against him.
Your turn.
@ Big Lo
We shouldn’t hold anything against Manny if he retires after November 13th. The political stress in the Philippines will be the one to KO Manny. He looks to be the guy that won’t be beaten and if he is truly working for the people, Floyd will be a memory, the fish that slipped away.
Floyd has to many excuses and just because he said he only fights once a year is a bunch of hoopla brutha but you want Pacquaio to jump hurdles and it’s okay. Your boots are steppin on land mines bro.
@Honest,
First, I believe it was Jeff Mayweather who said the testing was the cause for the failure (not Sr).
Second, BOTH SIDES are littered with contradictions. I’m not so sure Pac has been contradictory, but certainly Roach and Arum have. And I think we all know that Floyd is a walking contradiction, but again, I’m not sure that Ellerbe has been contradictory.
These are some of the reasons I do not want to pick sides, because there’s too much uncertainty on EITHER side.
@Big Lo
But ofcourse you don’t think that he’s been called on his bluff since you don’t believe there was any negotiations..
and ofcourse your second line of defense, just in case you were wrong about the negotiations, is that Mayweather only fights once a year…
LOL! That’s all I can say…
@Big Lo
You know how a lot of the Mayweather fans say that Pac’s team is littered with contradiction especially with Koncs, Arum, and Roach that’s why it’s hard to believe them.
Well take a look at the current situation.. Mayweather Jr says “I’m not interested”, Sr says the negotiations fell because Pac didn’t agree to testing, Ellerbe says there wasn’t any negotiations, and GBP said they couldn’t comment because of the gag order.
So far at the moment there is no reason for Mayweather’s side not to clear out their side of the fence… If they wanted to prove that there wasn’t any negotiations that shouldn’t be hard to prove if it were really true would it? But at the moment all they could have is Ellerbe saying there is no negotiations and Sr saying it died because of Pac…
@Jesus,
I’ve said a few times, if Pac calls Floyd’s “bluff” and gives him what he wants, then the finger is pointing DIRECTLY AT FLOYD. If Floyd still doesn’t sign, or comes up with another excuse, then there’s nothing left to say!!
The one thing I will say, though, is that Floyd has said for years that he only fights once per year (so it’s an “event” when he fights, etc), so I wouldn’t hold it against him if he didn’t agree to Nov 13, but I WOULD hold it against him if he didn’t agree to May 2011.
Broken egg shells? I’m running in military boots…
@kray
This is the picture.. Greenburg was the middle man.. he was the mediator.. so there was mediation going on.. i guess the next thing I can ask you is to google what mediation means..
For your analogy, I just bought a house less than a year ago… I didn’t directly talk to the owners of the house I was buying but I spoke to the agent (mediator). Just because there wasn’t direct contact doesn’t mean there is no negotiations…
@ Big Lo
So Pacquaio takes the random blood test till fight night and give Floyd the lion share of the purse. Since you say you are not picking sides. What now?
Go ahead and give your honest take not swinging on any sides. Careful, the ground is littered with broken egg shells.
@Kray,
It could have been a negotiation if Arum’s offer included some of the things that May was looking for (a compromise on purse split or testing).
I don’t think we can say for sure until we know what was in his “offer”.
@An Honest Pacman Fan – Arum said he never TALKED to GBP, or Mayweather Promotions, or Richard Shaffer. I was streaming that conference call, and I heard EXACTLY what HE said. He made an OFFER to Team Mayweather THROUGH Ross Greenburg, who, in-turn worked with Al Haymon. Al Haymon was supposed to have gotten back to Ross Greenburg about the OFFER that was made by Arum, but, that NEVER MATERIALIZED, according to ARUM. So, who was Arum NEGOTIATING with? He made an OFFER. There was no back and forth. No NEGOTIATING.
If I make you an OFFER for your house, and you never get back to me, are we NEGOTIATING? The answer is NO. Like I said, if Arum did anything, he made an OFFER. If GBP wanted to keep up the charade of that being a NEGOTIATION. Oh well…I guess they fooled us all…for awhile. But, now…we know enough to know what it really was.
@Honest,
Also, just to be completely upfront, I did believe there were negotiations initially, because everybody was talking about it except Team May.
When Ellerbe said there weren’t negotiations, then I had second thoughts.
@Honest,
First of all, yes, I’m a Mayweather fan (but I like to think I’m a boxing fan – who is fair-minded and level-headed).
Second, I already read the post when you initially posted that (Ryan Dunn also posted time lines and such).
About the June 17 quote, I choose not to take much from it because a gag order CAN be present without the start of negotiations (IMO).
About the June 6 quote, I choose not to take much from it because it’s DLH talking (I’m not sure how much stock to put in what he says, especially because I understood that he really wasn’t involved in the negotiations – I think he was saying what we wanted to hear (or saying what he believed, without any proof).
GBP was the promoter, so they wanted to say the things that would sell the fight (much like the 3 million PPV sell of the Mayweather-Mosley fight).
It’s also possible that they were all trying to sell the fight to Floyd (Top Rank, GBP, and HBO).
What about the possibility that there were negotiations that Team May weren’t a part of? Is that reasonable?
@Big Lo
Yep. That’s what I believe and I’m not trying to convince you.. because I don’t think anyone will ever convince other people except their own selves..
I’m just pointing out the reasons for what I believe in and share it… if that doesn’t help others.. all I know is that.. oh well I tried…
@Honest,
I understand your point, loud and clear. You believe there was a negotiation and you want to call one side “liars”.
You don’t need to try to convince anybody. You’ve stated your position. It is what it is.
@Big Lo and Kray
Kray I know your a Mayweather fan.. so the first question goes to Big Lo… you are a Mayweather fan arent you?
I can’t believe I’m doing this.. I already said I won’t repeat myself but here we go…
- June 17, Schaefer said he can not comment of the status of the Mayweather/Pac negotiations because of the gag order…. So if the gag order is in effect.. is there negotiations or not?
- June 6, GBP President, Oscar Dela Hoya got quoted on saying “I obviously can not talk about the negotiatios, but we are very close.” So again, is there negotiations or not?
- Who represented Mayweather for the first negotiations with Pac? GBP… Who represented Mayweather for the Mosley fight? GBP… So if the 2 above statements are from GBP.. Is there really negotiations..
Glad copy and paste exists… takes the effort out of all of this…
I wasn’t saying pick a side Pac/Mayweather literally because you guys already picked that side since day one…
I just want you to make up your mind and decide what is really believable.
I understand as well that it is a he said she said.. but far out.. there is a lot out there that you can use to paint a clear picture in your head of what really happened..
I’m tired of repeating myself so read on my post below on what I have said and why I believe there was negotiations..
As you guys don’t think so.. sorry. I’m not going to explain anymore.. it’s your problem…
@Kray,
I tend to agree.
@Honest,
I guess it’s also possible that Top Rank and HBO could have been the ones negotiating, and then they came up with a contract that was sent to Team May. In this instance, Team May would be precluded from the negotiations, yes?
@An Honest Pacman Fan – NO. There MAY have been an OFFER made by Arum through Ross Greenburg. However, a NEGOTIATION would necessitate a back and forth dialogue of some sort, in order to come to an agreement. Silence from once side or the other, is not NEGOTIATING.
@Honest,
I’m not really sure why you are saying to pick a side. I choose the alternative. I’m not picking ANY side because I just don’t know. If I do pick a side, it will be primarily based on speculation and derived theories.
One side says there was a negotiation, the other side says there wasn’t. Without proof, there’s really no point in continuing the argument because it’s “he said/ she said”.
Also, to an earlier point, I do believe that there can be a gag order without the physical start of negotiations (it may not be likely or it may not be practical, but it can be present I believe – but this is an argument in semantics I supposes).
@kray
One simple question dude…
What do you believe, was there negotiations or not?
Is that to hard to answer?
@An Honest Pacman Fan – Honestly…who the hell really knows? What we do know is…NEITHER side even talked, at all.
@kray
If you pick there was negotiation.. then you also have to take the argument that there was a contract because this side of the fence is Pac’s side, and that’s what the midnight conference was for.. to get Mayweather’s answer with the agreed terms..
See on this side of the fence the story is that Greenburg mediated the negotiations and they worked out a contract that was believed to be fair for both sides and Pac’s team already signed..
So if you take this side.. there’s no more point to argue…
@kray
I said pick a side, was there a negotiation or not?
@An Honest Pacman Fan – How would we know it produced an agreeable term, if such negotiations did exist? I agree we don’t know what was in the contract, or if there was a contract.
I think we should stop with the argument of PED’s already. The current issue is why the second set of negotiations fell through.
We still hear all this oh maybe Pac didn’t agree to all the way testing.. but stop a while.. non of us has seen the contract.. so maybe he did.. after all, you don’t hear Mayweather Jr. saying he didn’t agree on my terms.. all he said is “I’m not interested”..
The one thing we should just do so we can stop this back and forth argument is to decide who we believe and what we believe…
Was there really a negotiation?
If your answer is yes then you can pretty much argue that the negotiation did produce an agreeable term (noone knows what’s in it) that was drawn up and needed Mayweather’s signature.
If your answer is no… then I don’t want no part of having to convince you anymore… if you can’t logically weigh it out in your head.. that’s your problem..
blame only on the Mayweather, he is the deciding factor and he is having a vacation, his reaction in general does not fall within the context of the spiraled nego. that is taking place. many fans do not understand the real logical fear that the Mayweathers is undergoing at the moment, they have to divert it to other avenues hoping that the tide of opinion might be re directed in the course they are trying to assemble. the die hards of course are already clinging blindfolded but the eye of the storm are just circling around waiting for the ultimate course set for the eventual one time hit.
@Jesus Jones,
What makes me think Floyd is clean? Nothing, and I have NEVER said he was clean. What I have said is that he very well could have been on roids (someone – maybe Ryan Dunn – pointed out that Floyd could be roiding in-between fights).
So, it’s is completely reasonable to think ANY fighter is roiding, and I have never said contrary. However, what I have said is that from here and now, let’s test and get it out in the open. If you were roiding in the past, well you wonj’t be able to do it anymore.
But, one thing about Floyd vs. Pac, my counter argument to that notion would be that Floyd came up in weight over his career (gradually over the years), but Pac made the jump from 130 – 147 in a 2-year period.
@Phoocquiao,
Also, about Floyd demanding the test from Pac showing me he’s scared? I wouldn’t choose to use that word (and that may be the difference between us). It certainly shows that there is some concern there, but I think if he were scared he wouldn’t have agreed to 50-50 (but even more directly, he wouldn’t even entertain the idea of a fight with Pac – instead of stringing people along just to let them down).
correction…
“Therefore, he made the second bout with Holyfield, contingent on Holyfield taking the additional drug TEST”…
@Phoocquiao – I don’t think anyone will argue with the fact the Floyd is ‘scared’ of a fighter on PEDs (or one he perceives to be on PEDs). Who the hell wouldn’t be? Tyson was too. Therefore, he made the second bout with Holyfield, contingent on Holyfield taking the additional drug (ironically, in NEVADA).
But, there’s healthy fear and there’s paralyzing fear. Which one do you think applies to Floyd (and Tyson)? I’d say the former. Minus all the trash talk, he just asked Pac to confirm whether his ‘healthy’ fear was warranted. I just so happened Pac has developed a fear (whether it’s ‘healthy’ or not is debatable), based on a single incident, of having his blood drawn on, or very close to, the day of the fight, and his subsequent loss of that fight. They both have their stories, and they are sticking to them.
Pac may have inched a bit closer, to overcoming his fear, by coming down a few days, on the cutoff. And garnered back some of the respect he lost, from the first go around. Those things benefit HIM. But, he’s really done no more than Floyd has to make the fight happen. Floyd’s ‘fear’ still remains. And unless Pac can completely overcome his own ‘fear’, which in-turn would help Floyd overcome his, there will be no fight. I’m only putting the onus on Pac, to do that, since he asked for the fight, this time. When Floyd asked Pac for the fight, he conceded to 14 days, to help Pac with his ‘fear’, and address his own.
!!STOP PICKING SIDES & PICK BOXING!!
“Both sides are to blame”
I am sick & tired of articles and back & forth negative comments about this potential fight that hasn’t taken place. Fans from both sides only wants to blame the other side. It’s obvious these two guys and the promoters don’t want this fight. Ask yourself… how hard is it to make this fight happen when both sides look to make $40-$50 million? This so call negotiations are puting a black-eye on the sport and overshawdowing other fights between great fighters. We the fans deserve this fight. If you really love the sport of boxing, keep blaming the fighter you hate and also blame the fighter you love. The sport of boxing was here long before these two fighter & will continue long after these two fighters are gone!
@Phoocquiao,
If Pac is concerned about having a mental disadvantage from blood being drawn, then that’s a legitimate concern (IMO). Likewise, if Floyd is concerned about the mental impact of thinking the guy your fighting is on PED’s, then that’s a legit concern.
I’ve said in a previous post (long ago), if Floyd is truly trying to clean up the sport and is legitimately concerned about roids in boxing (which is a legit concern), then good for him. Likewise, if he is ONLY doing it to weaken Pac or to get a psychological advantage on Pac, then that’s unacceptable (in my book) – he SHOULD want to beat the best Pac out there (not a watered down Pac, not a weight-drained Pac, not an old Pac, not an unconfident Pac, etc).
About the NSAC commission hearing on OST, I don’t know enough about it to comment. Didn’t the presenters have to be invited or something? I’m not sure that just anybody could show up and testify. But, since there were official supporters of OST testing there, I’m not sure that Team Mayweather had to be there (as I understood it, the purpose of the hearing was so that medical professionals or professionals who otherwise dealt with drug testing standards could testify).
Lastly, as far as Floyd fighting thru a broken hand, didn’t that occur during the fight (or at least it was aggravated during the fight). I don’t think he came into the fight with a broken hand.
I am glad that you admitted to being bias (and that you set the record straight about the reasons – although I don’t agree about your Dr. King analogy because there are black people out there who say Dr. King was unfaithful to his wife and they hold it against him).
Thanks.
!!STOP PICKING SIDES & PICK BOXING!!
“Blame both sides”
I am sick & tired of articles and back & forth negative comments about this potential fight that hasn’t taken place. Fans from both sides only wants to blame the other side. It’s obvious these two guys and the promoters don’t want this fight. Ask yourself… how hard is it to make this fight happen when both sides look to make $40-$50 million? This so call negotiations are puting a black-eye on the sport and overshawdowing other fights between great fighters. We the fans deserve this fight. If you really love the sport of boxing, keep blaming the fighter you hate and also blame the fighter you love. The sport of boxing was here long before these two fighter & will continue long after these two fighters are gone!
@ Big Lo
What make you think that Floyd is clean? Pacquaio and Mayweather both started at 106. Just because Floyd felt he could not bring the power to where he’s at now justifies that Pacquiao is a cheat because he did.
You cant single out one. You have to call both on it. And Mayweather is a boxer in boxing just like Pacquaio.
@ Phoocquiao
The big difference between the two ideology is that Pacquiao in boxing is living off the land and Mayweather is developing the land. Oscar De La Hoya was the glass half empty the glass half full in this category. Mayweather developing the sport around him has killed it. Some sympathizer and American sports wrters have become blinded by the show and not the sport any longer. They have turned it to this one person who enjoys having his ego stroked every second and they have made him a monster. An ego so big that protecting it’s assets was the ultimate goal and the media loathes on his game. Just look at the firestorm the Mayweathers have created with the Blood Gate issue. Sympathizer fanned the flames instead to getting to the truth. Some of these reporters are a shame. At least in the tabloid game, ones they smell something fishy, they go after it. The dude from Lethal Weapon was a perfect example of digging dirt instead of spewing dirt.
Anyways, I really don’t care who Pacquaio fights, just get it over with and get that 8th crowning achievement. It won’t matter how you view it anyway cause Mayweather’s name will be a long side that part of boxing history no matter how you spin it.
@Phocquiao,
Put your bias aside for a minute and consider this:
Floyd is scared to fight a roided Pacman. If in Floyd’s mind, he thinks the test is the only way to know for sure, he won’t sign until the test is given (when Holyfield fought Tyson the 2nd time, Tyson required a steriod test and Holyfield told his team that he would agree to if the results weren’t given until after the fight – in other words, he wanted it to weigh on Tyson’s mind all thru the fight. So, it’s the same concept here – if Floyd believes that Pac is on PED’s, then it’s going to weigh on his mind and he won’t sign).
So, the belief is that Pac starting roiding when he moved up in weight. So Floyd isn’t scared to fight the Pac that fought Morales, Marquez, or Barrera because there was no concern at that point. But, Floyd is scared to fight the Pac who fought Cotto, DLH, and Hatton, because there was concern at that point.
Let me ask you one question, do you think Floyd would have been scared to fight the Pac who fought Marquez just 2 years ago?
Floyd fans – DIVAS
Floyd fans – YOU FUNNY
@ Jesus Jones
Thanks man.
Also take into consideration that Mayweather is turning 33. he can’t be in a position to where he has to literally fight to stay relevant. As long as he can keep up the illusion of being the best fighter of this generation, then he can remain relevant to the game. If Pac meats him, then Mayweather is no longer the best. Coupled with the fact that no one likes him anyway, he’ll be spit out by the majority of the boxing public.
Of course he’ll still have some fans. hell, even Zab Judah still has a decent following.
Well said Phoochiao, business 101.
Don’t be fooled. Mayweather doesn’t want any part of Pacquiao.
Here’s why
Because it’s a better business to avoid Pac than to just fight him. He can ask for the bigger split for anyone else he can fight, so he’ll make okay money. Still not as much as he would fighting Pac. No where near as much.
But it’s still better business to avoid Pac.
Mayweather builds himself up around his undefeated record. He uses that record to build up this illusion that he is unbeatable. Which of course isn’t true. He’s not unbeatable, he’s just unbeaten. He also makes himself a heel and tries to stay relevant by being controversial. A large portion of the people who buy his fights just want to see him lose.
So what do you think will happen if/when he finally get’s Ko’d? People will stop watching, that’s what. He won’t be able to hide behind his record or the illusion of being unbeatable. Also, the people who want to see him get Ko’d will get that and will lose interest in Mayweather all together. So he’ll lose that huge audience that wants to see him lose, cause they’ll be satisfied.
So then, Mayweather will find himself in the position where he’ll have to fight more than once or twice a year so that he can stay visible. He’ll also have to take on much harder opposition in order to regain some of that greatness that he would have lost bey taking a loss.
He also knows that if Pac knocks him out or even beats him on points, he’ll be the man in boxing. His name will be almost irrelevant when compared to Pac’s. Especially since most people who watch Pac, watch to see him win and be exciting. A loss for Pac doesn’t mean as much as a loss for Mayweather because they’ve build up their careers in different ways.
So yeah, Mayweather has a lot to lose by fighting Pac. So much so that it wouldn’t even be worth it.
sorry, I meant waste of time – that’s what lack of sleep can do to you.
@Ryan,
I think it’s a worst of time carrying on. What we need is the person who set the gag order to come forward, explain the details of it and how it was enforced.
otherwise everything we do or say here is complete guess work.
Personally, I’m done with both of them, well I should say following this none sense. If either man fight quality competition, will I tune in, yes. But I do mean quality, even if that means fighting the new up and coming fighters out there such as the Khan, Bradley, Berto, Williams. But not a Cotto 2 or should be banned for life margi-Cheato, I can’t bring myself to shell out that kind of money to support another Cotto beatdown or put any of my money in the pocket of a guy who literally had bricks in his gloves and could have killed a man. I think Floyd will fight either Berto, Sergio or Williams next. Wish pac would fight Bradley, Berto or Williams next. (as I say this with a heavy soul saddened that Arum/BGP couldn’t let go of personal differences to give us the fight we want)
GOLDEN BOY PROMOTIONS AND MAYWEATHERS ARE THE MOST STUPID LIARS IN THE PLANET!!!
@Ryan,
It doesn’t help that fact that the two sides don’t like each other (from what I understand).
Team Mayweather HATES Arum & Top Rank (and vice versa). Golden Boy has had their differences with Team May.
They wouldn’t even talk with each other (Team May hires GBP to negotiate with Arum; Arum discusses the negotiations with Greenburg & HBO; Greenburg relays the info back to Haymon).
Somebody below said it best – this is a soap opera!!
Hey look, even if there wasn’t any negotiation, the PBF camp could’ve immediately denied it on the day or after the day Bob Arum gave Floyd the deadline for the Nov.13 fight. But no. Instead they chose to wait for the deadline to expire and that’s when they denied any talks at all.
Okay, Hardnox and others. Now we get to pick sides. Take of this what you will, but Arum recently reacted to Ellerbe’s statement from yesterday…
“This is like absurd unreality. I’m not going to be party to this sh\t. When I heard about [the statement] I thought it was a joke. Ross said he was talking to Haymon. He certainly wasn’t making it up. And Haymon was relaying conversations to Ross allegedly that Floyd had with him. At least that is what Ross says.
“If there is no negotiation, who imposed the gag order? Why they’re doing this is absurd. What is motivating them to put something like this out? I’m not going to speculate, but what are they doing? Schaefer said there was a gag order. Who could there be a gag order from if there were no negotiations? From the sky?”
There you have it. Do we believe Ellerbe’s “absurd unreality”, or side with Arum’s pathological lying? You can’t have both, I don’t think. Were there negotiations or not? It’s a simple question to ponder.
…ryan
@Big Lo
I think the onus is on ODLH though, and many people like to villify Manny or Roach for forcing the catchweight. Manny could not have come up to LMW and perhaps not even full WW without giving up too much in size.
My point is that the weight they fought at, without using hindsight, could have been a negative for either man. It wasn’t a shoe-in that Manny would have the advantage.
ODLH didn’t train for the right fight, I don’t think. That includes everything from making weight, to fight strategy.
Lastly, I am now wondering, with ODLH saying three weeks before the fight that he’s been comfortable at 145 for three weeks already, whether he was the zombie some anti-Manny preachers like to claim.
The speed difference seemed to be the single most drastic difference. Oscar fought Floyd two fights prior and looked very game if a little past his prime. He aged against Manny, but guess what? So did Mosley. Mosley became just as inactive as Oscar did when Oscar fought Manny.
That’s all I’m saying.
…ryan
ITS IMPOSSIBLE THAT IN YOUR TAEM WILL NOT SIGNAL WHATS HAPPENING. BE TRUE TO YOURSELF. YOU CANNOT DEFEAT D MAN NOW. MAYBE LATER.
@Nick,
I agree. He had brilliant potential and would have matched up well against many at lightweight/ junior welter.
Unfortunately, from a boxing standpoint, his demons got the best of him. From a humanitarian standpoint, his demons got the best of his family.
Very tragic all around!
@Big Lo
R.I.P. Edwin Valero…
It’s awesome to hear news about him even know he is passed. Such a promising talent. Very unfortunate how his life took a turn for the worst.
Also, just to clarify my post below, I am NOT one of those who says that DLH was weight-drained and that’s the reason for his loss (because I am of the belief that once you lace up the gloves, there are no excuses).
I was surprised that DLH weighed in so low and then came into the fight weighing less than Pac, but that was his decision (probably because he and Nacho thought he would need speed to contend with Pac).
@Ryan Dunn,
I don’t think the “sudden” loss of weight was the issue with DLH. The issues were that he hadn’t fought at that weight for 7 or 8 years, and that he was drained (regardless of how long he claims to have been at that weight “comfortably”).
He was also sparring with Victor Ortiz and Edwin Valero, and many reports out of his camp were that he was getting beat up (Valero was asked not to come back to camp).
If you recall, he was sporting a black eye for a few weeks before the fight (Valero claims to have given it to him, but the camp is saying it was Ortiz).
Valero also claimed that Pac would KO Oscar (primarily because of the amount of success that Valero was having in sparring – and because he said Oscar didn’t want to do his road work).
what was dela hoya told before, we are very close for a deal! you call that there was no negotiation? is dela hoya not from golden boy? only an idiot cant understand this situation…like you floydiots!!
I don’t understand the Floyd’s Logic then, Oscar says that we are too close for the deal, golden boy says no negotiations took place, jef mayweather says that negotions fail for the second time bcaz Manny didn’t accepetd randon test up to fight day. Floyd ducker says he is going t retire for two years. If no negotiations took place then how come oscar said that we are close for the deal, ger mayweather is saying they failed bcaz manny didn’t accepetd the randon drug test. All that means that negotiations took place but failed due to floyd’s being sacred of Manny Speed and Power,
I was simply trying to have a logical debate with these guys. But it was like the blind leading the blind.
The truth of the matter is no one knows whole story. However, it’s only a matter of time before everything is laid bare.
@boxer,
You’ve got it wrong. I wrote that last comment after An Honest Pacman Fan said this,
An Honest Pacman Fan says:
July 19, 2010 at 10:16 pm
@Ryan
Sorry mate.. I’m getting tired.. I’ll have a break for a while..
I’m sure you got them all covered..
That’s why I said “I am going to sleep too”.
It was not after Ryans post. Ryan and I may have been writing at the same time but unfortunately his post came out after mine.
It’s all good boxer as long as you call the shots. Most important motto I cherish is from a customer of mine when I used to work retail back in the mid 90′s. Cat was always sitting at starbucks next to the shop drinking coffee reading a newspaper, plain shorts, shirt flip flop. One thing he said that stuck forever was “Always be nice to everyone no matter what it is or where it is you work. You’ll never know when your about to meet your next boss.” Haha! Met all my bosses through work.
@ JESUS JONES
IM NOT AS HIGH AS THAT MAN. IM A 10% STAKEHOLDER. BOUGHT 5% LAST YEAR AND 5% MORE THIS YEAR.
@ anonymous
anonymous says:
July 19, 2010 at 11:54 pm
@jak off
I already told you, that´s what your mother does for a living.
LOL! F**K YOUR A CHILD. NOT THE “YOUR MAMA” LMFAO! PROOFS ALL THERE.
AND NOT ONCE HAVE YOU SAID ANYTHING REMOTELY INTELLIGANT ABOUT THE POST! JUST A COMPLETE AND UTTER F**K WIT!
@ anonymous
is that hard to believe. i luv boxing. i have a really gud pa that takes care of the admin. i deal direct with clients and im holiday as where i am its the school holidays and i choose to be home with my kids.
but dude, seriously who cares what anybody does for a creed. that dont make a man.
your the one with the “my d**k is bigger than yours” BS!
answer some of the questions or F**k off you idiot!
And I say good riddance!
It´s been loads of fun ladies and gents but I have a long day of thinking up innovative ways of brainwashing America and beyond, better ways than Bob Arum, Manny and Floyd although they´ve done a pretty good job pulling the wool over most peoples eyes so far. lates bit$tches
@jak off
I already told you, that´s what your mother does for a living, not me, I know you get confused since you were a little crack baby but please don´t confuse me with your mom, take your meds and you´ll calm down.
@ the media director that cant come up with a name.
gud 4 you and your job. with all ur intelligence maybe you can answer some of the questions below?
didnt think so.
@jak
no, that would be your mother but thanks for asking
@boxer
Please. Are we to believe that Mr. Boxer, Mr. Percentage shareholder, a very successful individuals spends hours upon hours posting away on a boxing message board?
@ ryan
thx 4 that cheers.
@ anonymous
i’ll take that as an admission you were wrong then aye. and boy, i dont get let go, im a percentage stakeholder. eg im the one that lets people go!
@anonymous. For a MEDIA DIRECTOR you sound like you have a very low self esteem. Are you sure you’re not a retired hooker?
After reading 290 comments of this article, I am now a fan of these posters: Jesus Jones, An Honest Pacman Fan, Bjorn, Ryan Dunn, and boxer, for having sound and unbiased arguments.
Not because I’m a pinoy but because your arguments held solid ground.
Mayweather and our man should fight. Let’s see who is the best. If not this year then maybe next year.
One cannot claim for greatness if what he is doing is only for money. Beat the best out there and then you will be great.
By the way,
if our man Pacquiao is found taking PEDs or any illegal substances that contributed to his achievements in boxing, then we will despise him just like any other common citizen here. Make no mistake. But until then, our man deserves all the accolades. The excitement and fun he gave to boxing fans and even non boxing fans is so great.
Mabuhay po kayo
@jak
It´s my job to sound stuck up and demeaning so do us all a favor and reserve your comments to someone who actually could give a damn, which surely is not me.
Wow! Still no Dave Larhr article?
@boxer
You better get some rest, you have a hard day as a glorious insurance broker ahead of you tomorrow, we need at your best to sell lots of contracts otherwise we´re going to have to let you go since you had a really poor month in June….
@boxer
If you meant the ODLH quote about being comfortably at 145 for six weeks before fight night, here you go…
youtube .com/watch?v=si8FUnJZjtk
…ryan
@boxer
Which information are you asking about?
…ryan
Hahaha..
Ladies and gentlemen.. Let’s get ready to rumble…
On the red corner.. boxer
On the blue corner.. anonymous..
Now this is better than all this Pac/Mayweather drama.. LOL!
@boxer
For someone with a generic name such as ´boxer´I hardly think you are a one to knock my well though up name.
On the list of best money making professions insurance broker is not anyone near the top hundred, you never hear anyone boasting about being an insurance broker, it´s rather a lame profession if I don´t say so myself.
I on the other hand am a Media Director, a highly sought after profession where million dollar budgets are just another day at the office, Fortune 100 clients are the norm and changing the way the public views advertising just part of what we do and after all that we make a pretty penny so enjoy your lame life as insurance lackey or whatever it really is that you do.
sorry i should have said pac without peds.
ryan,
where did you get that info man if you dont mind me asking?
cheers
@pacman on peds
“Negotiation involves ZERO third-party. So we rule out what happened via Greenburg(a third party) as negotiation.”
jeez dude. give it a rest seriously. f**k mate, negotiations most definetly can take place through a third party! stop distorting complete and utter bulls**t!
eg in my line of business we deal with seperations all the time and if a husband and wife “dont get on” the only way to negotiate is THROUGH A THIRD PARTY! eg THROUGH MEDIATION f**ken hell man, this is the s**t im talking about. just type s**t and make guys dumber!
Just found an interesting quote while searching for ODLH’s interview saying the fight was going to be made. This quote, however, is from three weeks before his fight with Pacquiao…
“Oscar De La Hoya, three weeks before the fight with Pacquiao…
“I’ve been weighing 145 pounds now for the last three weeks. The weight is no problem. I feel strong. I do have to admit that in the first couple of days that I did make the weight, about a month ago, I did feel a little light-headed and weak. But now that we got used to it, and now that weeks have passed by, we feel strong and fast and very comfortable with welterweight. I’m even thinking about going down to 140 after this fight.”
So he weighed 145 for six weeks then, considering going down further. So what happened? Where did he become suddenly weight-drained? I hadn’t read this quote before, but it certainly throws some questions back at what many people consider to be an unfair win for Manny.
Hmmmmmm.
…ryan
@ An Honest and Ryan
We share the same frustrations with what has happened. I believe Arum and Team Mayweather could have done better. Why Greenburg in the first place? Why couldn’t Arum reach out to Golden Boy to start afresh? Why couldn’t Golden Boy reach out to Arum to start afresh?
Why Greenburg in the first place!!! Unless they wouldn’t talk to each other like some kids. The whole thing has been most unprofessional.
Sweet dreams. Bye.
While we ponder what was mediated, what was negotiated, which orders were gagged, who is lying, who is telling the truth, I made a graph representing both fighters’ PPV histories, if you guys care about those sorts of things…
liftingfaces [dot] com/uploads/pacquiao_floyd_ppv.jpg
Enjoy.
…ryan
@Ryan
At the moment I am skeptical about what they have agreed on (terms) but the picture still points to the fact there was negotiation (or should I say mediation)
I just wanted to see the fight.. grrr…
LOL!
@ An Honest Pac fan
Our only unclarity here is the actuall difference between “negotiation” and “mediation”.
The two are not the same.
Negotiation involves ZERO third-party. So we rule out what happened via Greenburg(a third party) as negotiation.
Was it mediation? I believe so. We had a third-party trying to get the two main parties to work out an agreement. This was no different from what that Judge tried to do in January when negotiations failed. This is time, the negotiations didn’t even start, and mediation was used right from the start.
Very weird.
@Pac Without PEDS
So you deny that Greenburg, the mediator in the negotiations, ever talked directly to either party?
I don’t know how far Bob’s lying goes, but I’m sure Greenburg would have one or two things to say about that if it were true.
…ryan
@Pac without PEDS
I wasn’t giving you a link.. I just copied and pasted what the definitions are..
Try typing in google:
“What is mediation”
@Pac without PEDS
Dude the key line here is this:
“Mediation may be used where negotiation has reached deadlock”
that means that a mediator can be added into the equation to help the NEGOTIATION..
The mediator provides both sides an unbiased view to help the (wait for the key word) NEGOTIATION to move along..
Having a mediator only enforces the fact that there is indeed negotiations…
@An Honest Pac Fan
I followed your web link and got this:
“WordNet Search – 3.0 – WordNet home page – Glossary – Help
Word to search for:
Display Options: (Select option to change) Hide Example Sentences Hide Glosses Show Frequency Counts Show Database Locations Show Lexical File Info Show Lexical File Numbers Show Sense Keys Show Sense Numbers
WordNet home page”
There are several people who provide the distinction between negotiation and mediation better, but their authorities may be doubted. But I think the Law Society of UK’s take can be accepted:
“The difference between mediation and negotiation :
In negotiation solicitors act for their clients to broker a solution, whereas in mediation a neutral mediator works with all parties (who may each have appointed their own solicitors) to assist them to reach a solution. Mediation may be used where negotiation has reached deadlock.”
lawsociety.org.uk/choosingandusing/howtosolvedisputes/mediation.page
Solicitors mandated by clients can act directly and enter legally biNding arrangements for their clients. Negotiation = direct talks, done by the parties themselves or by appointees(solicitors as per above) who can enter legally binding arrangEments for their clients.
Meidation inlvoves a third-party (Greenburg). Greenburg had no powers or standing to enter into any legally binding or contractual arrangements on behalf of Mr Pacquiao or Mr Mayweather.
We need not fight over this. Everyday use of the two words would indicate clearly negotiations could not have happened.
Dunn says:
“Then how was it that I negotiated a $180k salary through a recruiter, for a company I didn’t meet until after we had negotiated terms?”
Simple.
Direct talks isn’t automatically face-to-face talks. As you might have read already, when your solicitors/lawyers act on your behalf, they can enter into negotiations or direct talks without you ever meeting the other party.
Mediation connotes resolution. In your case, the recruiter wasn’t resolving a problem or dispute you had with the company. There were contracts you signed and the company signed, using the recruiter as your common appointee facilitating direct talks or negotiations betwen you and the company, with the result that the outcome was legally binding.
I am going to sleep too.
ciao!
@Hardnox
“Isn’t it possible to have a gag order that extends over a period of time within which negotiations are expected to take place?”
No. The gag order has no grounds if there is nothing to keep quiet. Keeping quiet the absence of a negotiation is an oxymoron, just like not telling your mom your girl isn’t pregnant.
Ya dig?
…ryan
@Ryan
Sorry mate.. I’m getting tired.. I’ll have a break for a while..
I’m sure you got them all covered..
@Dam dummies
You don’t know any more details than anyone else here, so while we UNDERSTAND what you’re saying, you are making some key mistakes, and not following your own advice.
Here is one example…
“After May 1 or should I say after the test dates cut offs came out PAC said I’ll do the 14-day cutoff.”
Those words never came out of Pacquiao’s mouth. It was falsely reported that he said he would do 14 days, but you will have a hard time trying to dig up a credible source who has a valid quote from him saying that.
It never happened.
Floyd never addressed the purse split this time around, either.
Arum was loose and vague about what was agreed to on the blood testing also, whether part of the gag order, or Arum not wanting to divulge anything for want of future negotiations, I don’t know.
And so on and so forth.
…ryan
@Ryan Dunn,
All this is very unnecessary. I asked you a simple question.
I said that isn’t it possible to have a gag order that extends over a period of time within which negotiations are expected to take place.
It’s a simple question. If you don’t know just say you don’t know.
Because I don’t know either.
@Hardnox
You know, I think you are mixing up terms. There is such a thing as a super injunction, used mostly in Europe.
A super injunction prohibits the press from reporting not only the details of the topic at hand, but it also prohibits them from reporting that the topic at hand even exists.
A gag order is used to prevent the media from putting out details or info out on that topic, though the topic itself can be disclosed.
Bottom line, there has to be a subject matter to put the gagging order on, and in this case the gag order was placed on the negotiations themselves, and prohibited details of the negotiation from getting out.
For Schaefer, Ellerbe, Arum, Floyd and Manny to obey the gagging order (we can’t expect trainers to obey anything hahaha), the very existence of the negotiations is provable beyond a reasonable doubt.
The results of the negotiations can yield absolutely nothing, but the negotiations still exist.
Follow?
…ryan
People are so racist, that they ignore all the facts that are slapping them in there face and continue to vent there hatred for a man that non of them actually met not once in there life.. Now Ellerbe is this big liar because of what Arum said, how phucking retarded.. Let me see if I can make the dummies understand.. FMJ is NOT with GBP, he has his own company MP (UNDERSTAND).. So what anyone from GBP have to say DOES NOT matter.. FMJ sent Schefer in for the FIRST negotiations last YEAR (UNDERSTAND).. After the fighters chose to go there separate ways that was the end of that situation delete those negotiations from your head, there dead (UNDERSTAND).. After May 1 or should I say after the test dates cut offs came out PAC said I’ll do the 14-day cutoff.. ONE problem things are different, after the fight FMJ said no full test no fight.. But we going to come back that.. When PAC said he agree, everybody in Team Mayweather was like, agree to what, u must be negotiating with himself (UNDERSTAND).. That was the last thing u heard from team mayweather I mean he just fought.. All of a sudden a deadline, (What the Phuck) are they still negotiating with themselves?? That’s all u hear is arum and roach, saying we’re almost there, not a word said from team mayweather, the last thing they said WE ARE NOT IN NEGOTIATIONS… GBP was never granted the power to speak on mayweather behalf, and everyone knows there’s no need for a mediator it’s PBF way now r no way.. With that said, Arum and greenburg really j*w*d u dummies..
Pac without PEDs says:
July 19, 2010 at 9:55 pm
@Ryan Dunn says
I suspect you are being pedantic with this gag order thing. Gag order cannot automatically mean negotiations are taking place. Gag order is gag order. Since the gag order was in place before any negotiations, a gag order can exist without negotiations. So if you are asked how the talks are progressing, you cannot say they have not started since that would breech the gag order. No comment, negotiations started or not.
If I should also be pedantic, I can argue that negotiation automatically means direct talks. Since Greenburg was a go-between, only a mediation took place. Negotiations could not have taken place since Arum admitted no direct talks.
I GIVE UP! THERES JUST NO TELLING SOME PEOPLE!
I’LL LEAVE IT TO RYAN AND PACFAN TO CLEAN YOU BOYS OUT
@bjorn,
I think you need to read my comment again.
I said there is a risk of Pac losing if he fights someone out side Top Rank. I didn’t Cotto or Margarito.
Those two are Top Rank fighters, Arum has control over them, and there for a certain amount of control over the fight conditions.
@Pac without PEDs
“If I should also be pedantic, I can argue that negotiation automatically means direct talks.”
Then how was it that I negotiated a $180k salary through a recruiter, for a company I didn’t meet until after we had negotiated terms? Eventually I ended up flying out to New York to meet them, but we negotiated nearly every detail before we ever spoke.
Your pedantry falls short.
…ryan
@Hardknox
Hahaha I’m using the English language to try and be explicit so we don’t go in circles. I’m not complicating anything.
If there are no negotiations, there is no need to obey a gag order.
If your uncle doesn’t hit you, there is no need for him to have a restraining order filed against him.
It’s cause and effect. Here’s what I mean…
CAUSE: Floyd and Manny are going to negotiate the fight, and don’t want the negotiations to fail due to public perception.
EFFECT: A mediator is brought in to keep all parties in line, and a gag order is placed ON THE NEGOTIATIONS, so that no details are revealed to the public, and no slander is spit out that may cast one fighter or the other in a less-than-favorable light.
Say what you will, but Arum did not slander Floyd. He may have played his little deadline game, I’ll give you that. Just like Roger and Floyd Sr. kept prattling on about Manny not being sh\t and that his son would knock him out if he took the tests, etc.
So no, I don’t think acknowledging that there are negotiations are part of the gag order. The gag order restricts and prohibits details from the negotiations from being shared with the media.
What hard evidence do you have of any details that were discussed? None. The purse split issues are totally speculative, and Floyd’s quotes on wanting a bigger split are from two negotiations ago.
…ryan
@Pac without PEDS
Google it:
Definitions of mediation on the Web:
•a NEGOTIATION to resolve differences that is conducted by some impartial party
•the act of intervening for the purpose of bringing about a settlement
wordnetweb.princeton.edu/perl/webwn
You crack me up so bad…
@Pac without PEDs
Before Manny and Floyd fought ODLH, Manny made equal to or better PPV numbers than Floyd.
Also, Manny has 5 or 6 PPV fights on his resumé. He was a PPV attraction before Floyd.
And if he only fights bums, then why are he and Floyd the only two fighters in the entire sport who make anywhere near the same amount as eachother, neither of whom have another peer in sight?
…ryan
@Ryan Dunn,
You see this is the part I don’t like about you Ryan. I don’t know if you do it on purpose or you have too much information in your head, but I think you tend to complicate things.
This is what I am trying to say.
If a gag order has been put up for a certain period of time, with the expectation that negotiations will take place, wouldn’t coming out and saying that nothing is happening, and finger pointing, be deemed as breaking the gag order?
@Ryan Dunn says
I suspect you are being pedantic with this gag order thing. Gag order cannot automatically mean negotiations are taking place. Gag order is gag order. Since the gag order was in place before any negotiations, a gag order can exist without negotiations. So if you are asked how the talks are progressing, you cannot say they have not started since that would breech the gag order. No comment, negotiations started or not.
If I should also be pedantic, I can argue that negotiation automatically means direct talks. Since Greenburg was a go-between, only a mediation took place. Negotiations could not have taken place since Arum admitted no direct talks.
well said ryan,
@hardnox
checkmate!
To all,
All of your biases are showing. Mayweather & Ellerbe are lying because of this; Arum and Team Pac are lying because of that.
It sounds to me like pure speculation on ALL sides. To point to time lines and media quotes to make your point is reasonable, but it doesn’t make your end-point a fact. Instead of name calling and pointing fingers, why not look give the benefit of the doubt to both sides and leave the speculation out?
The negotiations could have broken down for a number of reasons (maybe somebody is lying, maybe nobody is lying, maybe there’s miscommunication). It depends on who you ask.
For every argument you can give that Team Pac is to blame, I can give an argument that Team May is to blame. And vice-versa.
It never ends. Personally, I think it’s time to move on. This fight isn’t happening (at least not in Nov), and if Pac doesn’t give Floyd what he wants (testing and/ or purse split), this fight will probably never happen (for whatever reason, and here comes the speculation again…).
@ hardnox
dude ur debate with pacfan is going nowhere cos you wont/cant entertiain a logical answer!
mate its not rocket science here. a gag order was put in place so that talks between the 2 camps could run smoothly and public/media free!
what dont you get or cant comphrehend?
@Hardnox
The gag order was for all involved parties as they related to the negotiations. The very existence of a gag order assumes there is negotiating happening.
Otherwise, how can we know what the gag order was for? It could have been a a gag order to make sure nobody spilled the beans to Floyd about a surprise birthday party.
But we aren’t that stupid are we? If you get a restraining order against an uncle who likes to come over drunk and beat the sh\t out of you, and the judge grants the restraining order, it exists, and it has a purpose.
When a mediator (Ross Greenburg) requests that all parties abide by a gag order for negotiations at a potential Superbowl scale boxing match, and all parties agree, then it, too exists, and it has a purpose as well.
The purpose, is to keep the negotiations quiet.
The purpose is not, however, to keep a bunch of very rich men silent about something that is not going on.
…ryan
@harknox
had to reply,LOL!
“I understand what you are saying. The thing is we don’t know how much money he can make from a Floyd-Pac fight. But we know there is a risk that Pac ends up losing badly and his stock plummeting. That’s too much risk for uncertain gain for Bob Arum. And this is true if Pac fought someone outside Top Rank.
On the other hand Arum has a fair idea on how much he can make by matching Pac in-house (he has done it before with Clottey). And if he can do it over several years that’s a safer and more reliable income for him.”
EXACTLY, You’ve just made my point. That is why he needs Pacquiao to face Mayweather first. If Pacquiao loses to Cotto or Margacheato, like you say, Pacquiao’s stock plummets. THAT IS EXACTLY TH REASON HE WANTS PACQUIAO TO FACE FLOYD FIRST. And he can’t do it “for several years” because Pacquiao will retire by then. THAT IS EXACTLY THE REASON ARUM IS SO DESPERATE FOR THIS FIGHT.
ok gtg, peace.
I’m literally sick of these two! i mean what a shame! they claim they love there fans and the sport of boxing but can’t put there differences to the side and lace em up. very sad. I really hope it doesn’t take my kids having kids before these two can meet.
@anonymous
dude, seriously. come on. that ur interested in what i do for a living is weird man. i shouldnt have to explain what or how much i earn to you, you cant even come up with a name!
you sound like a really bitter person that cant hold a logical conversation with anyone.
maybe you can answer the question that got you all steamed up though, then again that might be information overload aye bud.
ps you say
“trying to convince anyone you make a huge salary as insurance broker is just comical”.
google “what does a life insurance broker make” and then apoligise wee man.
@pacfan -
Ignore the mof.
He can’t even invent a name for himself.
Hiding behind the “anonymous”.
Just another FLAMIN’ FLOMO.
Talk to the serious fans instead.
Just shows who the “dirty savage” one is.
Make that “dumb dirty savage.”
LOL!!!
I’m outta here.
To all boxing fans, Floyd’s or Pacquiao’s, don’t hold your breaths on this one. Fight’s ain’t happening. It’s all just a sorry mess. I’m gonna watch MMA instead. LOL!!!(kidding)
To all FLAMIN’ FLOMOS, get some help, go see a psychiatrist or something.
@An Honest Pacman Fan
Yes we have been through this already, but you kept going backwards. The debate was going no where.
lets see what Ryan has to say.
@Hardnox
Sorry.. some of the posts I put up was directed at @anonymous..
@Hardnox
” don’t pretend to know everything, but isn’t it possible to have a gag order that extends over a period of time? After which everyone is free to talk?”
We have been through this over and over again dude… What is the gag order for?
And in fact having it for a long period of time.. what for? to sit around doing nothing? Come on.. it really isn’t that hard…
Everything on this board is pure speculation, the only logical conclusion we can make as one poster so eloquently stated: Floyd is a pu$$y, period.
the wiz is out
@An Honest Pacman Fan,
I have know idea what you are on about. You’ve completely lost me.
@anonymous..
The more you talk the more I prove my point.. Good luck on redeeming yourself.. LOL!
@Pac without PEDs
“Except, the first option for Mayweather is a non-option for him. He will not lose to Pacquiao if Pacquiao fights clean.”
LOL!
Dude.. you make it sound like its a walk in the park for Mayweather..
Okay I’ll give you some happiness, let’s say Mayweather is guaranteed to win because Pac will be easy (without his PEDS -ROFL)…. if you were him, $40m to fight a one dimensional fighter (walk in the park -ROFL) would you?
Next question now where’s Mayweather?
Oh…. mmmmm… “I’m not interested”.. LOL!
@Ryan Dunn,
I don’t pretend to know everything, but isn’t it possible to have a gag order that extends over a period of time? After which everyone is free to talk?
@pacfan
What truth, that you are a complete douchebag? yes, that probably does hurt you. Keep to your own retarded conversations.
Arum to Floyd
“I’m Your Huckleberry”…. “Say When”
@ An Honest Pacman Fan says -see how I can turn your argument around?
Except, the first option for Mayweather is a non-option for him. He will not lose to Pacquiao if Pacquiao fights clean.
But it is an option for Arum. Why put all your eggs in one basket by fighting Mayweather clean? Arum would earn the big one-off money fighting Mayweather and the IRS will give him a medal for that.
But can he milk Pacquiao a little further, perhaps?
Basic rule of thumb to spot an idiot..
- They make a smart comment (actually think it was smart)
- You call them out on how stupid they are
- They start swearing and cursing and calling names.. why?
BECAUSE THEY GOT NOTHING ELSE BETTER TO SPEW OUT FROM THEIR EMPTY BRAINS!
@bjorn,
I understand what you are saying. The thing is we don’t know how much money he can make from a Floyd-Pac fight. But we know there is a risk that Pac ends up losing badly and his stock plummeting. That’s too much risk for uncertain gain for Bob Arum. And this is true if Pac fought someone outside Top Rank.
On the other hand Arum has a fair idea on how much he can make by matching Pac in-house (he has done it before with Clottey). And if he can do it over several years that’s a safer and more reliable income for him.
@anonymous
Truth hurts doesn’t it?
LOL! Go to sleep.. I think you overused your brain…
LOL!
@pacfan
Who the F%&$ is talking to you? Go F%&$ your mother or sister or whatever Pac fans do, filthy savages.
@PAC without PED
Your logic is flawed. Manny’s style of fighting gives him a much better shot at sustained popularity even in defeat. Want proof?
Pacquiao loses to Morales, they make 350k PPV buys. They rematch after Manny’s loss, they make 360k buys. Since that loss, the only time he sold fewer PPV buys than the fight before was when he took a detour to go against D. Diaz (which shouldn’t have been PPV to begin with).
So, tell me again how a loss to Floyd would automatically ruin Manny’s worth? Do you think he wouldn’t give the fans a show, and that Floyd would make him look so bad that he wouldn’t have any more fans?
If that’s your argument, I suppose we can both speculate, but I’m going on facts both in the amount of money Arum would make vs. Floyd and Manny’s chances at sustained fandom even in losing to Floyd.
…ryan
No matter how you slice or dice it, no matter what kind of spin you put on it when it comes to Manny Pacquiao, Mayweather is nothing but a big pu$$y. Period it. The whole world see’s it.
@anonymous
Dude… you asked what boxer does for a living..
He gave you an answer… and you turn around and say he’s trying to convince you?
LOL! Sometimes it’s funny how some people could get so empty in the head….
@Hardnox
Funny how the gag order was a big indication and you even mentioned it yet you didn’t weight the situation right?
LOL! tsk! tsk!
So should we go back to the question of whether there was a negotiation or is there another story you want to tell?
@Hardnox
LOL! You are getting desperate dude.. Next time absorb everything and way out all the possibilities..
It’s not that hard to think logically you know…
Fu*k mayweather Fu*k pac
@boxer
trying to convince anyone you make a huge salary as insurance broker is just comical, good one, maybe tomorrow you´ll come with something better. you better get to bed, you´ve got lots of boxes to stack tomorrow.
@An Honest Pacman Fan,
I am only saying you stole the argument from Bob Arum because I have just had a look at ESPN and Arum is screaming about the gag order. what a strange coincidence?
@anonymous
lol! u have know idea do you?
hardknox –
Lost the thread?
Mine is still in the needle.
Kidding. LOL!
I was replying to your theory that Arum really didn’t want this fight happening.
Let me repost this –
Arum will make a lot of money WHOMEVER Pacquiao fights.
BUT HE WILL MAKE A LOT MORE, TRUCKLOADS MORE, IF GETS MAYWEATHER TO FACE PACQUIAO. Even if can make Pacquiao fight for two or three more fights, which is highly unlikely. That is why he wants this fight so desperately.
It can’t get simpler than that.
@Hardnox
I don’t have to defend the gag order dummy… I’m using Mayweather fans arguments against them…
You said something about the gag order so I turned it around and asked you what the gag order is for if there isn’t any negotiations…
Come on man.. you can do something better than that…
@ryan dunn
i agree. ross greenberg has no reason at all to lie. arum does, but lik you said implicating greenberg makes no sense.
hardnox,
you might as well bugger off mate, you cant answer questions put to you pal! and the answers you come up with are just lame dude!
@ honest pacfan
yeah, if ross greenberg comes out and says that he never spoke to arum, then i agree, arum is a complete idiot and a bigger crook than i already think he is.
@anonymous
Should use some name.. atleast we can address you…
1. Don’t ask if you are not going to believe the answer on the first place
2. Boxer or no boxer.. the current toping is not what’s going on in the ring.. the topic is what stopping them from getting into the ring.. and I don’t think your job has got anything to do with being able to think logically
3. For a person to accuse of someone lying you should have proof that they are lying.. and how much do you want to bet that you don’t have proof about boxer not telling the truth about what he does for a living? Does that sound like the same stuff the Mayweathers’ put on Pac or what?
@An Honest Pacman,
By the way, I have seen where you stole that “gag order” argument from. You got it from Bob Arum that’s why you are having such a hard time defending it.
@An Honest Pacman Fan,
Fair enough.
@Hardnox
Isn’t it funny when a lot of people start seeing the same thing..
and all you can think of is.. hey you are all one person and pretending to be a lot of you by using different names…
LOL!
Now I understand why you use the name Hardnox…
Cos it’s so hard to knock sense into you!
WHO WROTE THAT EXCUSE KNOWS MORE ABOUT THIS FIGHT NOT HAPPENING.
When the PED issue came up, someone wrote to Golden Boy claiming Pacquiao was scared of needles.
I have never heard Pacquiao himself say he was scared of needles.
Who would provide that excuse on behalf of Pacquiao?
Did that person lie?
Does that person know more about Pacquiao’s use of PEDs?
Is Pacquiao aware PEDs find their way into his system?
Ariza claims Pacquiao doesn’t know what it is he eats.
Is Pacquiao the one so adamant about blood test or it’s Arum?
Time will tell.
I don’t know where any of you get your info, but since the rumors of the negotiation happenee, ellerbe has gone on record to say that team mayweather isn’t negotiating with anyone, now all of you are saying why it took so long to say something, Bob arum has led all of you like sheep………..dummies..
All signs point to Floyd being scared. It´s as if Manny is standing in the parking lot outside of school and Floyd just won´t come out to fight him, he´s just biding his time until Manny gets tired and goes home. What other conclusion can we logicall draw here. I´m not saying Floyd is necessarily scared of Manny the person (although he may be), he´s more scared of the realization that he could lose and his aura of invincibility would disappear with that loss and everything that he ever was would be a farce, that my friends is real fear and unless Floyd and muster some serious ballz in the next week I think his fear will get the best of him.
No Ryan I didn’t actually read you comment(s). I was just announcing you majestic entry.
Hang on.
who am I talking to?
@bjorn, are you for real? maybe you need to read my previous comment again.
Somebody has definitely lost the thread.
your boy is afraid to fight pac, thats what a lot of boxing expert was trying to say even before the failed first negotiations
@boxer
An insurance broker on a great salary? Geez, you lie worse than Arum.
hardknox-
Arum will make a lot of money WHOMEVER Pacquiao fights.
BUT HE WILL NOT MAKE AS MUCH AS HE WILL WITH A MAYWEATHER-PACQUIAO FIGHT.
Can’t get simpler than that.
@Hardnox
Do you deny what I’m saying? Do you have any answers? Or do you only intend to be smug and sarcastic toward me?
…ryan
@ anonymous
lol! classic man. nah dude, im an insurance broker thats on a salary you can only dream of! (that also luv’s boxing).
obviously you were offended by my comment, but i take your non response as that you cant answer!
but hey, beats reading more dribble!
ps hardnox. you think im doubling up as an honest pacfan dude.
check my history and i think you’ll find we a quite seperate. that you think we are the same is funny. you just got your a** owned dude!
Ah! The great Ryan Dunn has arrived.
Tell us O’ wise one. Let us bask in you flawless facts and knowhow.
You are all knowing.
hardknox-
I thought you’re a Mayweather fan?
So you’re telling me that CLottey is not a “lesser fighter” compared to Mayweather? That Clottey is greater than Floyd?
Ok, I understand now.
Sorry,you gave me the impression that you like Mayweather.
Ellerbe is lying!!! hahaha trying to save face again.. Oscar Dela Hoya told spanish channels negotiations were almost done..
Im sure Ellerbe, Roger, & Floyd was watching ESPN or at least received some news as deadline was passing…
Why do they always talk $hit after deadline is over.. They could said something while the “Magical Negotiations” were taking place..
The fact of the matter is that NOBODY wins if Pac and Floyd don´t fight, it´s a lose/lose situation all the way around. The promoters, the fighters and most importantly the fans all lose out on what could be one of the biggest fights in boxing in the past 20 years if not more. In no other sport would even the idea of this ever happen, it´s pathetic.
@sinister –
Nahhh, were not watching him.
We actually looking for him. I think he’s behind those bushes.
Nope, behind that tree? Nope.
OMG, he’s hiding in the pool!!!
He’s underwater, hiding in his pool!!!
Is that how scared he is?
Is that your boy there, FLAMIN’ FLOMO?
Get him out or he’ll drown.
Go on,…you can do it.
Tell him Pacquiao is nowhere around.
No charge for the therapy.
Go on…c’mon,…you can do it.
Give him a big hug.
Greenburg has absolutely no reason to mislead either party, nor the boxing public.
If Arum is the one lying, he could have made it MUCH simpler by saying something like “We put calls into Floyd’s people, so far no response.” Why would he lie about negotiatons>
Why would De La Hoya seem to think a deal was close to being made, if there were no negotiations going on whatsoever?
Why would Schaefer of GBP say he is under a gag order for negotiations that didn’t exist?
Why would Ellerbe wait until the exclusivity between Floyd and Manny ran out to issue a statement refuting what Arum had claimed he had done?
I smell something fishy, and it ain’t Christian’s (Lahr’s, Williams’, Perez’s, etc.) sissy.
…ryan
@bjorn,
Where have you been?
Pac fought Clottey a few months ago, is Clottey a lesser fighter? YES. Did Arum make money off it? YES HE DID.
So what are you talking about?
My full take:
(1) Team Mayweather wants Pacquiao to accept random blood test before talks.
(2) Mayweather comes down to 50:50 split if Pacquiao accepts the test
(3) Manny won’t accept the test.
(4) Team Mayweather won’t take part in what they consider a time-wasting chat with Arum
(5) Arum needs to justify Pacquiao fighting someone else
(6) Greenburg needs big earnings for HBO given the toll of the recession
(7) Tight friends, Arum and Greenburg, create a diversion to blame Mayweather and hype Pacquio’s next fight.
(8) Arum needs to keep the possibility of fighting Mayweather real, since Pacquiao is popular because the public thinks he stands a chance of shutting Money’s mouth in the ring.
(9) Mayweather destroys the roots of Pacquiao’s popularity by killing the possibility of the two meeting, hence “I am taking time off [indefinitely”.
(9) Pressure on Arum for no in-house sparring session.
(10) Arum and Pacquiao face unpleasant options as the public detests Arum-preferred fights.
(11) Arum cornered.
@ boxer
So, what do you do, box oranges for a living?
I think we all have to admit the obvious here. When has there been so much red tape and so much BS when 2 fighters were at their peak and a fight between them so blatantly logical?? This is paramount to Ali vacationing with his family and not wanting to fight Foreman in Africa, oh but wait, Ali and Foremen were MEN that got in the ring and fought like they had a pair and they didn´t make 1/1000 of what these chumps stand to make. The whole thing makes me sick. These athletes are spoiled and they really don´t give a $hit about who is lining their pockets, the Fans, they don´t care about being the best, fighting the best, they just want money and fame. Perhaps it´s a sign of the times, sad times if you ask me.
PACTARDS, its over! Move on!!!!
You can keep standing outside of Floyd Mayweathers’ fence watching him swim in his pool, or you can move on to something new! What’s it going to be Pactards?
1) Mosely
2) Berto
3) Martinez
4) Bradley
5) Maidana
I promise there will not be a charge for that bit of therapy!
Just turn, and walk…go on! You can do it!
hardknox
Again you got it all inverted.
If Arum can’t get FLoyd and pits Pacquiao against a lesser fighter,do you think fans will want to see that fight?
Look around you.
Read the comments.
EVERYBODY WANTS TO SEE MAYWEATHER FACE PACQUIAO.
Some even stated thet they will turn away from boxing to MMA if this fight isn’t made.
Your theory is all inverted.
Arum is desperate to make this fight happen.
That’s why he did what he did.
With Pacquiao’s imminent retirement, there’s nobody else in his stable. He knows this is the biggest fight yet. Maybe ever in this era.
if pac loses to floyd he still a congressman and will still fight n draw crowds but if floyd loses he’s done all the ppl that follow who see wat they wanted to see n that’s lose!! Why follow floyd afterwards
@boxtop123
You make it sound like Pac has only fought Top Rank fighters the whole time he’s been with Arum.
Mate irregardless of how much GBP gets from Pac if he fought Mayweather… it all boils down to one thing.. he will still get a whole lot of dollars for it…
All of mayweather camp don’t watch ESPN cuz they didn’t know about the fight
Mayweather said he was not interested why didn’t he say what are u talkin about wat fight? There aint no fight
Is everyone on this site an idiot or what? Since when are boxing promoters honest, since when are they people that don´t tell a lie, the people calling Arum a liar and this and that act like they have never watched boxing before. Boxing is like politics, it´s all smoke and mirrors, taking anything these people say as the word of God is just ridiculous. Dislodge your head from your @ss and wake up.
Arum gbp hbo n haymond are all liars accordin to ellerbe
HARDKNOX
myself as well as others here have been saying for weeks that arum will not fight floyd and the reason he is fighting only top rank fighters is because arum gets 27% from pac and 20% from others totaling 47% plus promotion against floyd he only gets 27% of pac and has to split the promotion remember pac also has to pay delahoya a promoters fee as well and floyd will 4 sure have his hand in the promotion cookie jar cause he will co promote
il think about it ok. but think about the fact that mayweather avoids guys who throw tons on punches
@boxer
Thanks mate..
Seriously, I’d be angry at arum if it can be proven that he’s just played us all.. but nothing points to it except for what ellerbe stated… and the fact that they waited all this time to say that.. only points to one thing for me..
Saving face…
Come on now everyone. We all knew arum was lying lol answer this question for me: when was the last time mayweather fought twice in one calendar year? I remember the guy saying he only fights once a year. When the first negotiations fell thru he was done with PAC (arum) for the year. Absolutely nothing arum says I believe until there’s visual proof
How was this mega fight goin to revive boxin anywayz? For the hardcore fan boxin is at its best
@ honest pac fan,
dude you totally owned kevin & hardnox!
i luv it! they just cant give you straight questions. just questions on questions!
“Can you kindly explain to me why Schaefer and Dela Hoya mentioned the negotiations and held back details because of the gag order?”
Hardnox says:
July 19, 2010 at 7:52 pm
@An Honest Pacman Fan,
I can see that you have run out of steam, so I will let you be.
logic wins
(great answer hardnox)
kevin says:
July 19, 2010 at 7:32 pm
@AHPF
to tell you the truth no i cant but at the same time ODH said the same thing last fight so why would you believe him… hes a well-publicized liar… remember when “pacs punches werent that strong” but when he was on mayweathers side to get this fight made “Pacs punches were surprisingly hard” this guy is a liar and will do anything to try and promote/sell a fight if that means trying to promote before a fight is guaranteed i think that loser would probably risk it…. in my personal opinion anyway.
(way twist the question kevin)
the answer guys is simply there were negioations! an idiot can see that. a gag order was put in place for these negioations to run smoothly as they didnt the first time around. just fighting in the media etc…
that you guys and others cant accept this shows your complete bias. plain and simple guys.
im quoting an honest pacfan here, but all you one eyed floyd fans can attempt to tell us that there wasnt negotiations.
An Honest Pacman Fan says:
July 19, 2010 at 7:11 pm
@Kevin
Since you are so much smarter than all of us and you can read into things so well… answer these for us?
- June 17, Schaefer said he can not comment of the status of the Mayweather/Pac negotiations because of the gag order…. So if the gag order is in effect.. is there negotiations or not?
- June 6, GBP President, Oscar Dela Hoya got quoted on saying “I obviously can not talk about the negotiatios, but we are very close.” So again, is there negotiations or not?
- Who represented Mayweather for the first negotiations with Pac? GBP… Who represented Mayweather for the Mosley fight? GBP… So if the 2 above statements are from GBP.. Is there really negotiations..
there you go guys, fumble away!
ps there is no f**ken sense whatsoever to imply a gag order when negoaitations dont exist! idiots!
@MOO
all im saying is all those boxers are willing to trade shots to land their punch that they feel is more significant… they dont stick and move like a mosley, mayweather, berto, alexander, bradley hell even amir khan…. not saying they arent boxers or counterpunchers but they stand there and trade… plus the speed differential is ridiculous in those fights minus erik morales who in fact beat pac the first time but lost his next ones coming off of loses…. like typical fighters bob arum matches pac up with…. think about it thats all im saying
Mind you, am not saying I know everything. It’s just my opinion. Everyone has their own opinion and I respect that.
Well, my mom kept telling when I was young that if I kept looking at the same cause and the problem kept not going away, I should let go my assumptions and start afresh, looking at causes I had overlooked. The stone the builders rejected has become the corner stone.
Many sports writers have continued to blame and put pressure on Mayweather, AND THE FIGHT IS STILL NOT MADE.
Could the real cause be somebody else? Arum? Pacquiao?
We know Arum is a self-confessed liar.
Mayweather claims the biggest name in boxing HBO is lyin lol!! HBO dominates boxing!! It has for years
@bjorn,
Maybe you haven’t seen my previous comments, but I will repeat it.
I believe Arum was just trying to use Floyd to Sell Pac’s next fight just like last time (with Clottey).
I said this yesterday, before this news broke. And everything that’s coming out now seems to support my theory.
This nonsense about FLoyd not wanting to fight because his Felon of an uncle is headed back to the big house is a crock of $hit. Floyd has stated many times that he doesn´t even watch tape of his opponents and other than show lil Floyd how to punch a woman I doubt Rog can teach him anything so grow a pair and sign the contract and get in the ring, earn your $50 million and give $1 million to your uncle if you feel bad he couldn´t make it to the fight. Floyd could give 2 $hits about his family, he didn´t speak to his father for 10 years to the point where his dad was about to train Oscar and now we are to believe Floyd is going to shelve $50 million because he needs unclr Rog in the ring to fight Manny? Biggest fight of his life, biggest paycheck of his life and what conclusion can we draw about Floyd…..SCARED.
But i dont realy wana or need to argue. i Just wana see the fn fight
My p4p rankings
1.PACMAN
2.Floyd
3. Sergio Martinez
4. Paul williams
Also can i point out that this will be the 7th PACMAN fight in the same time that mayweather has faught SSM and JMM. Activity does count!
Just saw the article that “bottem feeder,” was talking about.
It’s just about on every boxing news sites. If that’s the case, Ross Greenburg is indeed to blame or at fault! Bob Arum was in direct negotiations through Ross Greenburg. Aparently he didn’t disclose any or all of the information to Al Haymon, Leonard Ellerbe or Richard Schaffer. Some kind of negotiation was going on. About a month ago Oscar DeLa Hoya stated that they were very close to a deal, on the Telemundo Channel. As for Snoopdogg calling out Pac, saying “if Manny wants to fight Floyd, take the test,” Snoop you’re the one that needs to take a DRUG test! There’s no telling how much drugs are in Snoop’s system. Floyd should, talk for himself! Not through SnoopDogg!
hardknox-
Arum not wanting this fight?
You got it all inverted.
Business psychology 101 -
Arum can’t get to Floyd.
So what did he do?
Use the media and the press.
Make Floyd react.
Someone at ESPN did.
Called Floyd a coward.
Now that got’s Arum’s ball rolling.
Baiting Floyd.
Playing with the sympathy for the “uncle Roger thing”.
To keep Floyd’s options open. Not to antagonize him.
Everybody was ganging up on Floyd and what did he say?
Don’t be too harsh on the kid.
He started using his Harvard and street smarts.
BECAUSE THAT IS HOW DESPERATE HE IS FOR THIS FIGHT.
SIMPLE.
The debate sadley will never end beause i dont believe mayweather will ever step up and fight pac.
Juan Diaz is that kind of volume puncher, so is Margachaeto. i simply disagree that any of those fighters are volume punchers. none of them consistantly throws any whare neer that number of punches. Pluss are you realy going to say that none of JJM, ODLH, Cotto, Barera, Morales are top knotch counter puncher or pure boxers or boxer punchers? are you for real you are basicly saying then that the only deasent boxers of the last 10 years are mayweather or mayweather opponents? Pac has wins over some of the best boxers of the last ten years any way you wana slice it. mayweather record simply is more selective and less impressive
@BJORN
BTW Andre Berto, Paul Malignaggi, Nate Campbell, kermit Cintron and Ricky Hatton have all accused pac of roids….. get your facts straight bub…. mayweather didnt start the comments jack
@MOO
zab judah at the time he fought mayweather had lightning fast hands to say it wasnt in the same league as pac or mayweather is just a lie dude…. but im done with the dabating i guess we’ll have to wait til next year once the ARUM PROTECTION PLAN is lifted
pac w/o peds -
Floy Sr. did an interview with the Grand Rapids Press after the Hatton fight. It was in that interview where he spewed out all the nonsense. Malignaggi jumped up on the band wagon just before his rematch with Diaz in an interview with boxingtruth radio.
Get your facts straight.
Look up the archives.
I even posted the chronology in one of the comments sections of the articles on this site.
@nissan.350,
“First off why wouldn’t Arum try to make this fight happen? there is wayyy too much money involved.”
Good question!
I have been asking myself the same question, in particular, why is he not even considering other fighters outside Top Rank?
could it be that this guy was hit particularly hard by the recession, or did someone Madoff with his money? because find it hard to accept that someone who has been in this business for such a long time could retain such a big appetite for money. It can’t be common greed surely.
The only logical answer is that in Manny Pacquiao he has a steady and reliable stream of cash. He will not put that at risk for just one pay day when he can get paid over and over for years to come.
@JESUS JONES
hahahha prove it…. like you told me before in a previous argument about roach not letting pac fight mosley? if you never saw the contract than how do you know its there? lol hypocrite….
Their still tested before every fight and pac has never been dirty. I have to agree that zap judah had comproble had speed but hees not in the same class as mayweather or pacman.
kevin says:
July 19, 2010 at 7:08 pm
@JESUSJONES
your dumb dude…. its ARUM killing the fight if it only takes 10 days to put a fight together for margarito or cotto why give mayweather a deadline almost 5 months out? oh yea because its a fictitious contract that never happened
@ Kevin
I hate to say it but your either dumb or just don’t get it.
@MOO
like i said none of those guys are as big of a volume puncher as williams martinez and pac but then again who is…. and ricky hatton was a vicious volume puncher to the body before he fought mayweather… just because it wasnt 100 jabs doesnt mean it isnt a lot its proportional to the punch while 10 jabs arent of any volume if you throw 10 right uppercuts as an orthodox fighter thats a hell of alot…. if you throw 30 body hooks ina round… thats alot of PUNCHES…. it all depends…. do you know boxing? and what volume puncher has pac faced? what slick boxer/counterpuncher has pac faced? what pure boxer has pac faced? the only ones you can name have either beaten pac or were robbed of the fight… lol and you know what im talking about so the cure for pac has been proven… and avoided by the arum protection plan….
Arum and Pacquiao are turning down the biggest fight of the century simply because Pacquiao won’t do blood test that most clean sports people do.
Paulie Malignaggi and Citron had made public their suspicions about Pacquiao taking PEDs long before Mayweather Snr did.
PAC is tha only one that shot Floyd up,. . Tha fool is obviously doesn’t wanna fight PAC.. Relax…. What relax?? .. . He just straight up scared of tha little guy.. Lmfao
@MOO
they are tested urine before the fight and the testing with morales was before roach made plans to jump this guy up to welterweight…. im just sayin…
mosley, emmanual agustus, demarcus corley? again i have to ask are you a fan of boxing? because none of those men are or ever have been volume punchers they are all boxer punchers and couter punchers, although agustus is extreemly un orthodos and cant realy be put in any box. Hatton no my friend has hatton ever thrown 100 punches a round like paul williams or pac or martinez ….NO. hatton is a straight forward brawler with no defense do speak of. Mayweater has never faught a volume puncher. pac has faught several counter punchers you even admit JMM is a pure counter puncher.
@Pac
Yeah, money is a badass, he is turning down essentially the biggest payday of his career and in the history of boxing, yipee, you go maywweather, you are one bad mo fo!?!?!? seriouslY?
@An Honest Pacman Fan,
I can see that you have run out of steam, so I will let you be.
logic wins.
kevin –
Then the fishy smell is your own imagination.
Let me teel you a magician’s secret.
When they ask you to pick a card, any card, they already know what you will pick. They either pause the card a split second longer or converse with you, tell you things which will associate images and thought processes with the card.
It’s called “sublime suggestions”.
It works moslty with gullible persons.
Don’t tell me Floyd Sr. worked his magic on you.
I knew Mayweather would own Arum in the end. In and out of the ring, Money Mayweather is a badass.
@Hardnox
Just answer the question and maybe you’ll find yourself in the right path…
@MOO
zab judah is a volume puncher as well as being as fast if not faster than mayweather, mosley is just as fast as mayweather…. but those are the only two who can compete
First off why wouldn’t Arum try to make this fight happen? there is wayyy too much money involved. And second Arum’s been vocal about this for the past 3 weeks why did Mayweather’s camp just respond now? they been living under a rock that they didn’t know Arum was trying to make this happen? and third why would there be a gag order if negotiations weren’t in the works? Simple Floyd’s camp is covering for his cowardness.
Every boxer is tested before every fight by the nevada state commision so to say pac hasnt been tested is simply a lie. pluss he did blood tests the day before the morales fight lets not go around saying pac hasnt been tested every one who fight in nevada is tested before every fight
@MOO
i said they arent counterpunchers who arent willing to exchange punches. they arent sslick boxers…. and no-one pacs fought is faster than he is. as far as wolume punchers ricky hatton was one until he fought mayweather so was mosley, emmanual agustus, demarcus corley etc none as big as williams, pac, or martinez…. but pac hasnt either….
Also their is no one faster than pacman except mabey mabey mayweather? so have you seen mayweather fight anyone as fast as him? thats a big no
@An Honest Pacman Fan,
I thought we covered this. You are now going over old ground.
We agreed that one can put up a gag order and EXPECT negotiations to take place.
You are saying “…gag order exists because there is negotiations going on..”
Those are two different things.
“Yesterday I was lying, today I am telling the truth.” – Famous Bob Arum quote.
@BJORN
LOL i never said i believed his crusade ever, much like i said i dont think pacs on anything but i can see where the suspicion comes from…. you are innocent until proven guilty but if your never tested then its impossible to prove? if nobody is in your house can anyone prove you dont take a shower? nope… all they have is the stench that tells me somethings fishy….
@kevin
the point here is that they are proven liars as you said… Both GBP and Arum..
And that’s both sides of the fence..
At the moment for me, I can’t workout the contradiction in Mayweathers fence so I’m waiting for a proof to prove me wrong..
And how am I not to see the contradiction in Mayweather’s fence when for such a long time the fuss was about getting the fight made… and all he comes out with is “I’m not interested..”
He didn’t even say, I don’t like the deal they are offering me.. that would have been so much easier don’t you think?
There is no point in geting all worked up people about this or that.The answer is simple MAYWEATHER IS A P U S S Y.
@kevin
If clottey isnt a counter puncher then what is he? have you watched ODLH in his prime, are you a real boxing fan? He prefers to have oponents come at him so he can counter thats part of why he had such problems with mayweather and bhop. same with morales. And you dont seem to have an answer to mayweather avoiding volume punchers do you?
NEW TWIST!!! Mayweather was seen holding hands with Ricky Martin over the weekend in Miami….
@AHPF
“Yesterday I was lying, today I am telling the truth.” -BOB ARUM
its his freakin catchphrase for crying out loud… if leonard ellerbe and al haymon floyds actual promoters said something about negotiations, not some 3rd party associate, then maybe id agree with you but i personally dont.. because bob arum is a proven liar…
@Hardnox
I really don’t know how to make you see the irony of your logic.
So just answer me this instead..
Why have a gag order if there is no negotiations?
@An Honest Pacman Fan
“…gag order exists because there is negotiations going on..” I think you are going backwards here.
But if you accept that a gag order can be a bit more complicated, then don’t be surprised that Floyd and his team didn’t want to break it even though there wasn’t much happening.
if arum really telling a lie about the negotiations… why floyd keep his silence…
@MOO
out of those you named only JMM can be considered a counter puncher or at least one thats not willing to stand there and trade THE WHOLE FIGHT… arum doesnt set pac up with boxer-counterpunchers…. plain and simple… when have you seen pac fight a fighter faster than himself?
@MOO
FLOYD fought one volumne puncher. Castillo, and Floyd lost.
We all know that Mayweather avoids volume punchers like pac, williams, martinez. People wana say pac avoids counter puncher but its clearly untrue, ODLH, JMM, Clottey, are just some of the recent counter punchers that manny faced. name one volume puncher that mayweather faught? you cant
@AHPF
to tell you the truth no i cant but at the same time ODH said the same thing last fight so why would you believe him… hes a well-publicized liar… remember when “pacs punches werent that strong” but when he was on mayweathers side to get this fight made “Pacs punches were surprisingly hard” this guy is a liar and will do anything to try and promote/sell a fight if that means trying to promote before a fight is guaranteed i think that loser would probably risk it…. in my personal opinion anyway
@Hardnox
Ofcourse it’s not…
But the simplicity of it is that the gag order exists because there is negotiations going on.. that’s all you need to know.. that’s all I needed you to see…
@An Honest Pacman Fan,
It looks like you are making you own gag order.
For all we know there could have been an expiration date in there, fines and punishment for whoever is found to have broken it, there could have been a lot of explicit and implicit things in there (especially if it was set up by a very powerful person).
So I don’t think a gag order is as simple as you make it out to be.
@BJORN
BUT HOW DO YOU KNOW HE’s ONE!!!
the only way to prove it is to either A.GET CAUGHT RED HANDED B.GET TOLD ON or C. TAKE A TEST and seeing as how the first to will never happen because roach and arum are making CASH out the butt with him the only other way to know is to take the test? you know another way to prove it? i dont personally think hes taking anything but i do understand where the alarm comes from im just calling a spade a spade bro…
Wake up people!! the writing is on the wall Mayweather is so damn coward to face Pacman, Does he say anything not fair against to the contract when he was interviewed? the answer is NONE he just say he was not interested to fight now, he just want to enjoy the vacation and his lunatic Family.After all the bluff and bravado that he created he let you down again ROFL.. Its futile to defend him….
@kevin
okay. I’ll take your answer.. You don’t believe that there is any negotiations..
Okay. That’s totally fine.. Now since you are so good at knowing what arum is trying to do.. and reading into things of what the situation really is..
Can you kindly explain to me why Schaefer and Dela Hoya mentioned the negotiations and held back details because of the gag order?
@AHPF
arum knows pac struggles with pure boxers/counterpunchers and he wants to keep this pacman-money-train rolling so he’s ONLY gonna match him up with sluggers… youll never see him against berto, mosley, williams, bradley, or alexander…. because thats the only way pac has a CHANCE at losing or even looking bad… he is keeping the money rolling in because after pac top rank is done…. who will be the new face? clottey? margarito? cotto? dont think so….
kevin –
SIMPLE
Its called “baseless accusations”.
In law speak , it’s called defamation, calumny, vilification and slander.
From Floyd Joy Mayweather Sr.
Don’t tell me he messed up your head too.
Wait till Floyd Sr. sees Uasin Bolt do the 100 meters.
Floyd Sr. will faint and say Usain is a martian diguised as a human.
There comes a time when an anomaly comes to humans.
These athletes are born, not made or manufactured.
Shumacher can withstand 2.8G forces which will crush our normal bodies when he floors that ferrari F1 at 300kph.
They exist.
Pacquiao is one of them.
What is hard to understand about that?
@ BJORN are you bjorn ko?
@Hardnox
Umm… I really think you need to think about it a bit better..
Ofcourse the gag order comes before the negotiations.. it’s purpose is to give the negotiations a better chance..
Just ask yourself this, maybe it’ll help, why observe a gag order if there is no negotiations?
The only detail you need to know about the gag order is that it was put in place to make the negotiations easier and as I said give it a better chance of succeeding…
@JD
AGREED
@AHPF
no i dont think their were ever negotiations… ever since theyve been on bad terms arum has done his best to make floyd sound like he is scared of every top rank fighter (margarito, cotto, pacquaio) i think this is another way to make floyd look bad and save face for himself…. remember when manny was talking about one more fight arum wasnt saying anything to the media and trying his HARDEST to make the fight but ever since manny and roach said 2 to 3 more years… his mouths been open everyday and its “no big deal if they dont fight this year there is always next year” i just dont trust the pig known as arum
I Knew that there more to meet the eye on this! I am a Mayweather fan and I know that Pac fans can agree I am tired of this Soap Opera. At the end of the day the fight gets done
@An Honest Pacman Fan,
No I helped you. But it doesn’t matter.
The fact is we don’t know the details of that gag order. So you can’t use the fact that they may have been observing a gag order as an indication that negotiations were taking place.
@AHPF
your post is spotty itself mayweather isnt promoted by GBP hes represented by leonard ellerbe of MAYWEATHER PROMOTIONS in accompany with GBP everything goes through leonard ellerbe and al haymon first SO ODH saying stuff is about as valid as bob arum… theyre both liars… if you dont here it from the man or his team first then you probably shouldnt believe it…. just sayin… ODH doesnt sign mayweather fight you dont have to talk to ODH to get a fight with floyd you talk to al haymon or leonard ellerbe….
@kevin
You know.. this debate about the drug testing is so yesterday and I’m tired of trying to make people understand..
So let’s do this simple and plain:
1. Innocent until proven guilty
2. Do you think there is negotiations or not.. if not answer my previous post for you about Schaefer and Dela hoya.. if yes.. then that means the negotiations have worked out what the want to do with the drug testing…
@Hardnox..
Ahh.. you worked it out my good man…
So what do you say.. the negotiation is existent or not?
@BJORN
the alarms went off when a lil dude who weighed about 106 came up to 147 and was knocking out people who walk around at about 160 to 170 with ease? then they went off furthermore when pac agreed and then freddie roach said NO especially when yyou pair it with the fact 2 of his fighters have been caught juicing and had no idea. add the 4 different excuses that have been his reasons why he doesnt want the test and then sir you have an ALARM!!
@An Honest Pacman Fan,
You don’t get it. Come on think man. The gag order comes before the negotiations. A gag order is not the same as negotiations taking place.
Perhaps what you are saying is the fact that they were obeying a gag order could mean that negotiations were taking place. That’s what you mean isn’t it?
Floyd doesnt want to fight like he said. Thats the whole thing he doesnt want to fight. Its not gunna happen unless mayweather can get a tangible advantage that basicaly guarantees him the fight. Pac wants to fight and will fight no matter what mayweather does or doesnt do. That just 1 more reason why Pac is still #1 P4P
the main problem with this is that..
Why just Now?
Arum Was Blabbing for Weeks and Weeks
coudnt they have said something then?
seems to me this is just a ploy to detract attention from floyd himself
@kevin
I was correcting you because you tell someone that their analogy is wrong but you come up with another analogy that still has a hole..
If you want to pretend that you are better than the rest of us here.. better make your arguments full proof otherwise you will look more stupid than the one you are trying to insult…
@Kevin
Since you are so much smarter than all of us and you can read into things so well… answer these for us?
- June 17, Schaefer said he can not comment of the status of the Mayweather/Pac negotiations because of the gag order…. So if the gag order is in effect.. is there negotiations or not?
- June 6, GBP President, Oscar Dela Hoya got quoted on saying “I obviously can not talk about the negotiatios, but we are very close.” So again, is there negotiations or not?
- Who represented Mayweather for the first negotiations with Pac? GBP… Who represented Mayweather for the Mosley fight? GBP… So if the 2 above statements are from GBP.. Is there really negotiations..
@AHPF
ummm no its not your too simple minded to understand that the previous one was a very extreme analogy… how could the two be even compared? proving your clean is nothing like proving your not molesting boys…. if you agree with BJORNs initial analogy then your dumb…. point blank
kevin –
So tell me the, in Pacquiao’s case WHERE AND WHICH DETECTORS WENT OFF?
Your scenario is way off.
There was a VALID reason to ask for the receipt. Alarm went off.
Nahhh…the child molester accusation is more apt.
And I think sinister is one.
Manny Pacquiao and fans….MOVE ONE! It’s over! Mayweather basically said I will call you when I am ready!
Mosely
Berto
Bradley
Martinez
Maidana
Take your pick! If you want to see 500,000 PPV buys or less, choose Cotto or Margarito (In Mexico).
What will be your move Pacquiao?
@kevin
Even that detector analogy of yours makes you look stupid in your own case… the evidence of something fishy is that the detector went off.. how about with Pac.. you got anything to point to except for Sr…?
Nadda….
IM A BOXING FAN!!!!
thats why i hate bob arum… Anybody living outside the mayweather or pacquiao box can see whose fault it is…
@kevin
And your comparison to the little detectors that says you’ve stolen something is a crackhead Mayweather Sr.. mmm… very very good comparison…
@Hardnox
There goes your brain… If there was a gag order.. then the negotiation exists..
Think mate… what’s the gag order for if the negotiation isn’t happening…
Mayweather fans… support your brother here with his argument… he’s lost…
FLOMOS = Battered wives.
Pathetic bunch.
Now only you can answer the question -
Are you a boxing fan, or a normal Floyd fan?
Then it’s cool.Tis all good.
But if you’re just a FLAMIN’ FLOMO then the first line applies to you.
Battered Flomo.
@BJORN
thats a horrible analogy they are two different extremes its more like this
you go to the store buy something and the little detectors at the doors go off and it seems youve stolen something. if the police officer says “show me your receipt” are you gonna say “ive never stolen in my life, prove ive stolen before and ill show you the receipt”? no your just gonna get the fu**** the reciept and leave
@Sinister
Clottey didn’t have a fan base… so yes.. that is a big number…
Okay let’s break this down simple,
try and debunk these 2 statements:
- June 17, Schaefer said he can not comment of the status of the Mayweather/Pac negotiations because of the gag order…. So if the gag order is in effect.. is there negotiations or not?
- June 6, GBP President, Oscar Dela Hoya got quoted on saying “I obviously can not talk about the negotiatios, but we are very close.” So again, is there negotiations or not?
- Who represented Mayweather for the first negotiations with Pac? GBP… Who represented Mayweather for the Mosley fight? GBP… So if the 2 above statements are from GBP.. Is there really negotiations..
@bjirn, nope it didn’t hurt at all because noone would ever accuse me of such a thing. My character is much above that and those that know me and even meet me once would agree.
However; if I were accused, I could easily prove otherwise.
Why won’t Manny?
@ Kevin
We had this convo a long time ago. You aint walking me around the block. You know what’s crackin. It’s you who’s still making excuses.
Just like what that dude said, Floyd fans are like battered wives, lovin it till it kills em. A bit cold but realistically close.
Remember, I stopped buying Floyd fights more than 6 years ago. I stopped being a Floyd fan more than 10 years ago. You fools haven’t figured it out yet.
@An Honest Pacman Fan,
Yes you put up a gag order before the negotiations start, and then you ask them to get on with. Just because there was a gag order does not mean that negotiations took place.
sinister-
How many 6 year old kids have you molested lately???!!!
You haven’t?
Prove it!!!
Prove it!!!
See my point?
It hurt, rigt?
Who am the f__k am I to accuse you, right?
And why the f__k do you need to prove it to me, right?
Who the f__k am I, right?
Floyd himself ain’t talking about it anymore, so why are you?
Mayweather Sr. really messed up your head FLOMO.
Flomos can defend and keep supporting their fraud idol all they want but public perception sees Floyd as a cow.ard, a ducker and a bit.ch. Ha ha ha. I pitty these Flomos coz they’ve been backing up a fraud all this time. You are hurt because you can’t accept the fact that Pacuiao is twice the man Floyd is. That Floyd is dethroned by a little freak of nature.
@JesusJones
of course anything that isnt pro manny is a floyd nuthugger dude your the biggest bias person ever… NEITHER OF THEM ARE AFRAID OF EACHOTHER ARUM is killing the fight if you cant see it then you just dont want to point blank
@Honest Pac Fan, Are you proud of the 700,000 PPV buys?
For Pacquiao that is a lot!
I understand why you would be proud!
And the fact that Floyd did not come out with all guns blazing in his interview should not surprise you. Floyd is a smart cat, he knows that Arum is just trying to use him and his trash talking to hype Pacs next. So Floyd did the opposite. They are not getting any more quotes from him that’s for sure.
I don’t want to listen to anyone. It’s been validated that Floyd is fraud, over-rated, a ducker and a coward.
so manny hasnt fought since his sparring session with Joshua Clottey and his status actually went down.. because of who he fought and Mayweather Jr performance over Shane Mosley. So Manny gets to go do his election thing, not agree to the drug test and people dont even crucify him. Now that Floyd wants to take a break from boxing, he didnt say oh i dont want to fight Manny Pacquiao just chillin like Manny Pacquiao did after he won his election, he is getting called a coward.. give me a break. it goes both ways.
If you read the telescript Bob Arum even agreed not to speaking to any of Mayweather people! how the hell are you trying to make a deal without speaking to the main people in Mayweather CAMP!!!
Than you publicly give Mayweather a deadline! WTF
Its like yo bro i havent been dealing with you, have no idea whats your doing, but if you want to fight, lets do it Nov. 13th in vegas! LMAO
Bob Arum isnt getting any smarter the older he gets.
@Hardnox
Taking your theory…
If there was a gag order.. then there was really negotiations right?
What’s the gag order for if there was no negotiations?
So make up your mind, was there one or not? Did Mayweather not want to fight Pac or not? Did Arum really just make everything up or not?
This is from another article on Manny Pacquiao and his fans.
If you just hide your head and ignore the reasons Manny refuses to take a simple test, it will just go away.
Is that you PACTARD?
@Sinister
Noone cares about Pac? Are you delirious? Remember when they said that the Clottey fight wouldn’t sell?
Yeah.. they still did 700k…
Remember when the Mayweather/Mosley fight was suppose to do 4m? Oh I’ll just shut my mouth now…
@Insider and everyone else asking this question,
One of the reasons why I raised the “gag order” question is because Ryan Dunn gave me the Heebie-jeebies when he started talking about the Greenburg guy. He scared the s**t out of me. And then there was Bottom Feeder who suggested that the gag order may have been put up by Greenburg (unless I misunderstood Bottom Feeder, in which case I apologise). Now given this situation, and remember how easily they tried to shift the blame on Floyd the failed negotiations last time, do you think Floyd or his team would risk braking the silence?
We all know how easy it is to blame Floyd. So Arum breaking the gag order was not a license for Floyd or his team to do the same.
And perhaps the reason they are talking now is because the gag order is over and can not surfer the any legal or financial consequences.
ESPN have always been pampering Floyd until of late with PTI. Dan Rafael has always been a Floyd Nutthugger and a sympathizer this isn’t a surprise.
Insider, you bring some good insight. Noone cares about Pacquiao unless he fights Floyd.
If Pacquiao fought, Cotto, Margarito, Chavez, or any other fighter in the Top Rank Stable, he will struggle to get 500,000 PPV buys.
THAT should tell something to everyone!
A Pacquiao Mosely fight, or Martinez fight is his only option to get to 1.4 million PPV buys!
Anyone else will only deteriorate Pacquiao’s negotiation stance vs. Floyd Mayweather.
this here is from another article here –
Floyd fans are like the battered wife.
The battered wife will invent every excuse under the sun, defend her husband. “Fell of the stairs” for the broken ribs, “bumped into the cupboard” for the bruised eye,etc., justify everything, EXCEPT admit the fact that her husband just punched her in the face.
Is that you Floyd fan?
@stark: sounds like your boy is pretty well set and it seems like he took your money and ran away with it. The only time floyd cared for his fans is when the bank called and letting him know that his benjamins are getting low. Sad but true.
the biggest joke are cowardweathers and his pea brain flomos!!!
@Insider
You are angry because you feel like we are making up all this story about everything that is going on…
But look in the mirror.. you don’t know nothing too.. and you are making your own version of what Mayweather really is doing..
GBP not representing Mayweather.. mate.. you need to check your head… this isn’t the first time that Pac/Mayweather was meant to be made.. gues who Mayweather used the first time around.. GBP…
As I said.. I will be angry at Arum if it is proven that there is no negotiations.. because although I’m a Pac fan.. I just want to see the best fights…. so wake up…
just a waste of space posted by kevin!! no one wants to read that long long comment that he copied!! irritating just like duckweather!!
Ok let’s suppose there were no negotiations.
For pete’s sake, Floyd was called a coward on national TV.
He can at least say – “Right now, I’m on vacation. But send me those proposals and I’ll look them over”
or – “Have you met my demands yet”?
or – “Let me enjoy my vacation, then we’ll talk”‘
anything, anything at all except the “I’m not thingking of boxing right now”
What happened to his – “If you want to fight me, you know where to find me.” Or his “take the tests, then we’ll have a fight.”
WOW!!!
So crystal clear.
He never wanted the fight. Never as in never ever.
Simple.
@misunderstood your a joke
No amount of explanation can take away the fact that floyd jr is a fraud, over-rated, a ducker and a coward. I don’t want to hear any thing more.
LET ME FIGHT MANNY PACQUIAO I BELIEVE IT WOULD BE A GREAT FIGHT AND MILLIONS WOULD TUNE IN TO WATCH IT SIMPLY BECAUSE I HAVE THE POWER AND THE STYLE TO WIN BY KO!!!
Would you talk about your next fight having just come out of a massive fight? TBH Mosley is way ahead of Pacman come to ability and actual greatness. Pacmans greatness is fiction he’s fought nobody and if he as he’s fought the name not the boxer.
Arum to me has been the best. I will be a champion soon. Thanks to Bob and my last name.
another justification to floyd’s cowardice…
@An Honest Pacman Fan and who said that Floyd would be using GBP? Floyds his own man so they can say what ever but if Floyd sees no contract theres no fight or negotiations.
Floyd would want to promote this fight himself with his family their for he sees every penny.
Maybe Floyd doesnt want to respond to everything he sees maybe, he’s doing just what he said he’s doing and taking a break from boxing, because unlike most people he’s got more than just boxing to take care of.
I love Top Rank, they are making me a star. I have gotten away with taking steroids and my record still perfect.
The problem is I don’t know for how long my good grace will continue. They want to match me against Pavlik. Bob Arum told me that Pavlik is a drunk and doesn’t train as hard anymore. Also, he would be drained as he can no longer make 160lbs. And I will beat him.
I don’t know what if Pavlik unleashes one of those powerful right hand no in the script and I go to sleep.
Should I drink the Kool Aid and decline to fight Pavlik or believe BOB who assures victory?
@ Insider
“Now shut yo face”.
Nice one, sounds like you didn’t fall from the Mayweather tree. That’s kind of like saying you aint interested in boxing at the moment.
@Insider, you make a GREAT point! How much interest is there in Pacquiao if he isn’t fighting Floyd Mayweather?
ANSWER:…VERY LITTLE!!!!
If this is infact true I’d be angry at Bob and team Pac for making us all believe.
But in saying that I doubt a few things because of a few simple things…
1. Dela Hoya got quoted about the negotiation
2. Everyone involved from Pac’s team to Mayweather’s team were a bit gun shy in the media which only supported the fact that the gag order was in place
3. If indeed there were no negotiation, wouldn’t you think the easiest way to make Pac’s team look stupid was to come out and say no I didn’t get a contract. And when Bob had that press conference (supposedly if it wasn’t true) to wait for Mayweather, it would have been the best time for them to come out and embarass Bob and Pac’s team
4. Mayweather should have come out guns blazing when he got interviewed and only replied with “I’m not interested…”.. Typical Mayweather Jr. wouldn’t hold back if he wanted to say something, for him to only have a little to say doesn’t add up
5. GBP still hasn’t come out to tell their side of the story
There is too many things that’s not making sense.. but at the end of it all, we the fans miss out on what we deserve…
And just as a side note.. to all you Mayweather fans that says you don’t have a problem with Mayweather not fighting as he only fights once a year, or I’m glad he didn’t take the fight cos he deserves better…. You guys are the reason why we get divas in this sport… I wish all of you would just disappear….